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Armagh Sniper
10-11-2007, 05:02 AM
Turkey condemns US Armenia vote

The Turkish president has denounced a vote by a committee of the US Congress recognising as genocide the 1915 mass killings of Armenians by Ottoman Turks.

President Abdullah Gul said the decision was unacceptable and had no validity for Turkey, which has always denied any genocide took place.

The White House said it was very disappointed by the non-binding vote.

It fears Turkey could now limit cooperation in the war on terror and provision of military bases near Iraq.

The genocide bill passed in the House Foreign Affairs Committee by 27 votes to 21 - the first step towards holding a vote in the House of Representatives.

President Bush had argued against a vote in favour of the bill, saying "its passage would do great harm to our relations with a key ally in Nato and in the global war on terror".

Turkey is a regional operational hub for the US military, and some suggest access to Incirlik airbase, or other supply lines crucial to US forces in Iraq and Afghanistan, could be cut in response.

'Invalid'

President Gul was quick to attack the vote late on Wednesday evening, saying that some US politicians had "closed their ears to calls to be reasonable and once again sought to sacrifice big problems for small domestic political games".

"This unacceptable decision of the committee, like similar ones in the past, is not regarded by the Turkish people as valid or of any value," Mr Gul said, according to the Anatolian news agency.

The BBC's Sarah Rainsford in Istanbul says it is very unusual to hear such high-level political reaction so late at night from the Turkish government - a sign of how seriously it takes this.

Meanwhile in Washington the US Undersecretary of State, Nicholas Burns, told the BBC that the Bush administration was "deeply disappointed".

"The United States recognizes the immense suffering of the Armenian people due to mass killings and forced deportations at the end of the Ottoman Empire," he said.

"We support a full and fair accounting of the atrocities that befell as many as 1.5m Armenians during World War I, which House Resolution 106 does not do."

'Sobering'

Correspondents say Wednesday's result means that only a change of heart by the opposition Democrats, who control Congress, can now stop a full vote on the bill.

Divisions within the Foreign Affairs Committee crossed party lines with eight Democrats voting against the measure and eight Republicans voting for it.

Tom Lantos, the committee's chairman, had opened the debate by admitting the resolution posed a "sobering" choice.

"We have to weigh the desire to express our solidarity with the Armenian people... against the risk that it could cause young men and women in the uniform of the United States armed services to pay an even heavier price than they are currently paying," he said.

Mr Lantos, himself a survivor of the Jewish Holocaust, said he would introduce a resolution praising US-Turkish friendship next week, according to AFP news agency.

The Senate Foreign Relations Committee is expected to take up their version of the resolution in the future.

Border concerns

The controversy comes at a delicate time for relations between Turkey and the United States, our correspondent says.

Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan has confirmed that the Turkish parliament could discuss a motion as soon as Thursday that would authorise cross border military incursions into northern Iraq to hunt down Kurdish PKK separatists.

The move comes after an escalation in attacks by the PKK killed almost 30 soldiers and civilians in just over a week.

Mr Erdogan said such authorisation, which would be valid for one year, would ensure all options were available to Turkey in its fight against the PKK.

That includes sending troops into northern Iraq, where the prime minister said more than 3,000 PKK fighters are based. The government is under immense pressure though to act , but Washington has warned Ankara against any unilateral moves that would destabilise Iraq even further.

After the Armenian vote in Congress, our correspondent says, Turkey will be far less inclined to heed instructions from the US on anything.

NOTE: I posted this on another forum as well, so my apologies if you frequent both forums and have to endure the same thread twice ;)

Armagh Sniper
10-11-2007, 05:03 AM
Fair play to US Congress (for once). It's a shame, though, that the United States only recognizes genocides years after the fact.

Asmir84
10-13-2007, 06:37 PM
Hipocrats

Seabird
10-14-2007, 03:01 AM
Hipocrats

Would you care to elaborate???:confused:

Asmir84
10-14-2007, 03:06 AM
They are fond to declare genocide for that and not for Dresden for exsample. And look at bombing Baghdad, Vietnam war...

And this part of story

President Bush had argued against a vote in favour of the bill, saying "its passage would do great harm to our relations with a key ally in Nato and in the global war on terror".

Elaborate what? LOL

Seabird
10-14-2007, 03:23 AM
Well those people will have to stand in line because the Native Americans have a bone to pick with the US government if you really want to talk genocide!

Nah I was just wondering which incident you were referring, thats all. :icon_lol:

Asmir84
10-14-2007, 03:28 AM
Genocide is all around us, many times not even mentioned. Look at Africa, and Hutsi vs Tutsy tribes conflict, but they declare some forgoten one Turk-Armenia wars and killings as genocide.

Brits should be judged for that too. Colonialisam made them rather bloodthirsti. Notice South Africa, Zulu war...

Just example on top of my head. I'm sure every one of us should remember one or two events.

Fresh - Srebrenica, BiH.

Lobo1888
10-14-2007, 01:41 PM
Yey the point is that, Armenian genocide was discussed for too long and still many do not agree with recognition for political reasons. I don't care about political reasons.
1.5 milion people killed in desert, people who lived throughout entire Asia Minor, nobody can tell me it wasn't a genocide!
7000 people killed in Srebrenica, Bosniak civilians, however though those who killed were armed and commanded from Belgrade, Serbia wasn't find responsible for that crime. UN/Dutch forces even welcomed Serbs though they were supposed to protect civilians of Sreberenica. Fecking cowards!!!

Thousands of Palestinians were slaughtered by IDF, Europe is blind, USA supports that genocide.

What to say then, hipocrats! They do not care about Armenians, it's about incoming elections in US.

Daithí
10-14-2007, 04:15 PM
Yes Lobo. I think the situation in Palestine is a an ongoing genocide in front of us. The US are war criminals. And how the world cannot see that saddens me.

Turkish army chief says U.S. ties at serious risk

ANKARA (Reuters) - Turkey's military chief said on Sunday that if the U.S. Congress approved a bill branding the killing of Armenians by Ottoman Turks genocide ties between the NATO allies would never be the same again.
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"If the resolution that has passed in the U.S. committee is accepted by the assembly of the House of Representatives our military relations with the United States can never be the same again," chief of General Staff, General Yasar Buyukanit, told newspaper Milliyet.

"We could not explain this (keeping ties as normal) to Turkish opinion," he said in remarks published on Sunday.

Last week, a U.S. House committee approved the non-binding resolution, brushing aside White House warnings that it would do great harm to ties with NATO ally Turkey.

CELTICGUERILLA
10-18-2007, 03:18 AM
being from america i must say that the american goverment has finally done a good job and making that tragedy heard. but as someone posted earlier that u.s are a bunch of ****ing hipocrats who need top look at they govern themselfs and fix it. i think one of the big stereo types is that people need to hate the american goverment not the people of america.

Lobo1888
10-18-2007, 10:08 AM
being from america i must say that the american goverment has finally done a good job and making that tragedy heard. but as someone posted earlier that u.s are a bunch of ****ing hipocrats who need top look at they govern themselfs and fix it. i think one of the big stereo types is that people need to hate the american goverment not the people of america.

Calm down mate. There are americans and Americans. See the difference? americans are aware of shyte that goes around the world. Americans, however are aware of two towers falling down and belive because some muslim lads did that, all muslims should be nuked though many do not even know the real truth about 9/11 and where exactly to throw the nuke. Americans do not belive that americans are loyal to USA, and really, who could be loyal to corporate masonic government led by zionists? Latinos (job stealers), Chicanos (lazy), Irish (papists), Polish (even worse papist), Natives (wtf they exist???), Dixie (rednecks), Arabs (islamists), Filipinos (who needs them)... some people are too aware of their ancestry that they are just americans not the Americans. Wherever I met WASP he was full of stereotypes about the people that I mentioned above with common stereotype, also he was full of rage and hate towards muslims.
I make a difference, and belive me, because you are here I don't belive you are the Bush-loving nuclear cowboy.

Here is difference http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9jEUP5eZFsM

KillinSnakes
10-18-2007, 09:35 PM
The USA should get to fixing its own problems, what a load of *WORD FORBIDDEN**WORD FORBIDDEN**WORD FORBIDDEN**WORD FORBIDDEN*e to condemn a genocide a century old!! :icon_lol:

CELTICGUERILLA
10-18-2007, 10:18 PM
Calm down mate. There are americans and Americans. See the difference? americans are aware of shyte that goes around the world. Americans, however are aware of two towers falling down and belive because some muslim lads did that, all muslims should be nuked though many do not even know the real truth about 9/11 and where exactly to throw the nuke. Americans do not belive that americans are loyal to USA, and really, who could be loyal to corporate masonic government led by zionists? Latinos (job stealers), Chicanos (lazy), Irish (papists), Polish (even worse papist), Natives (wtf they exist???), Dixie (rednecks), Arabs (islamists), Filipinos (who needs them)... some people are too aware of their ancestry that they are just americans not the Americans. Wherever I met WASP he was full of stereotypes about the people that I mentioned above with common stereotype, also he was full of rage and hate towards muslims.
I make a difference, and belive me, because you are here I don't belive you are the Bush-loving nuclear cowboy.

Here is difference http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9jEUP5eZFsM


i agree with you. there are two types of americans, the ones who know that there country is going to *WORD FORBIDDEN**WORD FORBIDDEN**WORD FORBIDDEN**WORD FORBIDDEN* and that all great empires fall, and the other ones who believe in bombing all of the middle east into a parking lot. im the first one. its just like how there are two types of irish-americans. the ones who beleive in green beer and leprachouns( i think i spelt that right) and the ones who just want to see a 32 county ireland and will give all there support towars the withdrawl of england to there ancestrial land.

Diarmuid
10-18-2007, 10:31 PM
Turkey is secular enough these days that such a thing shouldn't bother them, but much like British-Irish skepticism, the secular Muslims still view Christian Armenia with skepticism and I've even heard the existence of Armenia alone questioned by Turks.

FTA69
10-19-2007, 08:49 PM
Turkey is secular enough these days

Very true, but in the place of Islam you have a fanatical belief in Turkish nationalism and the idolisation of Kemal Ataturk, such to the point that insulting him warrants a two year jail sentence. Turkey is also completely influenced by the military. In fact wearing a map of Kurdistan on a t-shirt will result in the same jail sentence on the grounds "defames the Turkish nation".

Personally I believe Turkish nationalism is much akin to Loyalism or Boer nationalism in South Africa.