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Puddies
12-15-2007, 03:37 AM
Message to Grassroots

Malcolm X
October 10, 1963

We want to have just an off—the—cuff chat between you and me —— us. We want to talk right down to earth in a language that everybody here can easily understand. We all agree tonight, all of the speakers have agreed, that America has a very serious problem. Not only does America have a very serious problem, but our people have a very serious problem. America’s problem is us. We’re her problem. The only reason she has a problem is she doesn’t want us here. And every time you look at yourself, be you black, brown, red, or yellow —— a so—called Negro —— you represent a person who poses such a serious problem for America because you’re not wanted. Once you face this as a fact, then you can start plotting a course that will make you appear intelligent, instead of unintelligent.

What you and I need to do is learn to forget our differences. When we come together, we don’t come together as Baptists or Methodists. You don’t catch hell ’cause you’re a Baptist, and you don’t catch hell ’cause you’re a Methodist. You don’t catch hell ’cause you’re a Methodist or Baptist. You don’t catch hell because you’re a Democrat or a Republican. You don’t catch hell because you’re a Mason or an Elk. And you sure don’t catch hell ’cause you’re an American; ’cause if you was an American, you wouldn’t catch no hell. You catch hell ’cause you’re a black man. You catch hell, all of us catch hell, for the same reason.

So we are all black people, so—called Negroes, second—class citizens, ex—slaves. You are nothing but a [sic] ex—slave. You don’t like to be told that. But what else are you? You are ex—slaves. You didn’t come here on the "Mayflower." You came here on a slave ship —— in chains, like a horse, or a cow, or a chicken. And you were brought here by the people who came here on the "Mayflower." You were brought here by the so—called Pilgrims, or Founding Fathers. They were the ones who brought you here.

We have a common enemy. We have this in common: We have a common oppressor, a common exploiter, and a common discriminator. But once we all realize that we have this common enemy, then we unite on the basis of what we have in common. And what we have foremost in common is that enemy —— the white man. He’s an enemy to all of us. I know some of you all think that some of them aren’t enemies. Time will tell.

In Bandung back in, I think, 1954, was the first unity meeting in centuries of black people. And once you study what happened at the Bandung conference, and the results of the Bandung conference, it actually serves as a model for the same procedure you and I can use to get our problems solved. At Bandung all the nations came together. Their were dark nations from Africa and Asia. Some of them were Buddhists. Some of them were Muslim. Some of them were Christians. Some of them were Confucianists; some were atheists. Despite their religious differences, they came together. Some were communists; some were socialists; some were capitalists. Despite their economic and political differences, they came together. All of them were black, brown, red, or yellow.

The number—one thing that was not allowed to attend the Bandung conference was the white man. He couldn’t come. Once they excluded the white man, they found that they could get together. Once they kept him out, everybody else fell right in and fell in line. This is the thing that you and I have to understand. And these people who came together didn’t have nuclear weapons; they didn’t have jet planes; they didn’t have all of the heavy armaments that the white man has. But they had unity.

They were able to submerge their little petty differences and agree on one thing: That though one African came from Kenya and was being colonized by the Englishman, and another African came from the Congo and was being colonized by the Belgian, and another African came from Guinea and was being colonized by the French, and another came from Angola and was being colonized by the Portuguese. When they came to the Bandung conference, they looked at the Portuguese, and at the Frenchman, and at the Englishman, and at the other —— Dutchman —— and learned or realized that the one thing that all of them had in common: they were all from Europe, they were all Europeans, blond, blue—eyed and white—skinned. They began to recognize who their enemy was. The same man that was colonizing our people in Kenya was colonizing our people in the Congo. The same one in the Congo was colonizing our people in South Africa, and in Southern Rhodesia, and in Burma, and in India, and in Afghanistan, and in Pakistan. They realized all over the world where the dark man was being oppressed, he was being oppressed by the white man; where the dark man was being exploited, he was being exploited by the white man. So they got together under this basis —— that they had a common enemy.

And when you and I here in Detroit and in Michigan and in America who have been awakened today look around us, we too realize here in America we all have a common enemy, whether he’s in Georgia or Michigan, whether he’s in California or New York. He’s the same man: blue eyes and blond hair and pale skin —— same man. So what we have to do is what they did. They agreed to stop quarreling among themselves. Any little spat that they had, they’d settle it among themselves, go into a huddle —— don’t let the enemy know that you got [sic] a disagreement.

Instead of us airing our differences in public, we have to realize we’re all the same family. And when you have a family squabble, you don’t get out on the sidewalk. If you do, everybody calls you uncouth, unrefined, uncivilized, savage. If you don’t make it at home, you settle it at home; you get in the closet —— argue it out behind closed doors. And then when you come out on the street, you pose a common front, a united front. And this is what we need to do in the community, and in the city, and in the state. We need to stop airing our differences in front of the white man. Put the white man out of our meetings, number one, and then sit down and talk shop with each other. [That’s] all you gotta do.

I would like to make a few comments concerning the difference between the black revolution and the Negro revolution. There’s a difference. Are they both the same? And if they’re not, what is the difference? What is the difference between a black revolution and a Negro revolution? First, what is a revolution? Sometimes I’m inclined to believe that many of our people are using this word "revolution" loosely, without taking careful consideration [of] what this word actually means, and what its historic characteristics are. When you study the historic nature of revolutions, the motive of a revolution, the objective of a revolution, and the result of a revolution, and the methods used in a revolution, you may change words. You may devise another program. You may change your goal and you may change your mind.

Look at the American Revolution in 1776. That revolution was for what? For land. Why did they want land? Independence. How was it carried out? Bloodshed. Number one, it was based on land, the basis of independence. And the only way they could get it was bloodshed. The French Revolution —— what was it based on? The land—less against the landlord. What was it for? Land. How did they get it? Bloodshed. Was no love lost; was no compromise; was no negotiation. I’m telling you, you don’t know what a revolution is. ’Cause when you find out what it is, you’ll get back in the alley; you’ll get out of the way. The Russian Revolution —— what was it based on? Land. The land—less against the landlord. How did they bring it about? Bloodshed. You haven’t got a revolution that doesn’t involve bloodshed. And you’re afraid to bleed. I said, you’re afraid to bleed.

[As] long as the white man sent you to Korea, you bled. He sent you to Germany, you bled. He sent you to the South Pacific to fight the Japanese, you bled. You bleed for white people. But when it comes time to seeing your own churches being bombed and little black girls be murdered, you haven’t got no blood. You bleed when the white man says bleed; you bite when the white man says bite; and you bark when the white man says bark. I hate to say this about us, but it’s true. How are you going to be nonviolent in Mississippi, as violent as you were in Korea? How can you justify being nonviolent in Mississippi and Alabama, when your churches are being bombed, and your little girls are being murdered, and at the same time you’re going to violent with Hitler, and Tojo, and somebody else that you don’t even know?

If violence is wrong in America, violence is wrong abroad. If it’s wrong to be violent defending black women and black children and black babies and black men, then it’s wrong for America to draft us and make us violent abroad in defense of her. And if it is right for America to draft us, and teach us how to be violent in defense of her, then it is right for you and me to do whatever is necessary to defend our own people right here in this country.

The Chinese Revolution —— they wanted land. They threw the British out, along with the Uncle Tom Chinese. Yeah, they did. They set a good example. When I was in prison, I read an article —— don’t be shocked when I say I was in prison. You’re still in prison. That’s what America means: prison. When I was in prison, I read an article in Life magazine showing a little Chinese girl, nine years old; her father was on his hands and knees and she was pulling the trigger ’cause he was an Uncle Tom Chinaman, When they had the revolution over there, they took a whole generation of Uncle Toms —— just wiped them out. And within ten years that little girl become [sic] a full—grown woman. No more Toms in China. And today it’s one of the toughest, roughest, most feared countries on this earth —— by the white man. ’Cause there are no Uncle Toms over there.

Of all our studies, history is best qualified to reward our research. And when you see that you’ve got problems, all you have to do is examine the historic method used all over the world by others who have problems similar to yours. And once you see how they got theirs straight, then you know how you can get yours straight. There’s been a revolution, a black revolution, going on in Africa. In Kenya, the Mau Mau were revolutionaries; they were the ones who made the word " Uhuru" [Kenyan word for "freedom"]. They were the ones who brought it to the fore.The Mau Mau, they were revolutionaries. They believed in scorched earth. They knocked everything aside that got in their way, and their revolution also was based on land, a desire for land. In Algeria, the northern part of Africa, a revolution took place. The Algerians were revolutionists; they wanted land. France offered to let them be integrated into France. They told France: to hell with France. They wanted some land, not some France. And they engaged in a bloody battle.

So I cite these various revolutions, brothers and sisters, to show you —— you don’t have a peaceful revolution. You don’t have a turn—the—other—cheek revolution. There’s no such thing as a nonviolent revolution. [The] only kind of revolution that’s nonviolent is the Negro revolution. The only revolution based on loving your enemy is the Negro revolution. The only revolution in which the goal is a desegregated lunch counter, a desegregated theater, a desegregated park, and a desegregated public toilet; you can sit down next to white folks on the toilet. That’s no revolution. Revolution is based on land. Land is the basis of all independence. Land is the basis of freedom, justice, and equality.

The white man knows what a revolution is. He knows that the black revolution is world—wide in scope and in nature. The black revolution is sweeping Asia, sweeping Africa, is rearing its head in Latin America. The Cuban Revolution —— that’s a revolution. They overturned the system. Revolution is in Asia. Revolution is in Africa. And the white man is screaming because he sees revolution in Latin America. How do you think he’ll react to you when you learn what a real revolution is? You don’t know what a revolution is. If you did, you wouldn’t use that word.

A revolution is bloody. Revolution is hostile. Revolution knows no compromise. Revolution overturns and destroys everything that gets in its way. And you, sitting around here like a knot on the wall, saying, "I’m going to love these folks no matter how much they hate me." No, you need a revolution. Whoever heard of a revolution where they lock arms, as Reverend Cleage was pointing out beautifully, singing "We Shall Overcome"? Just tell me. You don’t do that in a revolution. You don’t do any singing; you’re too busy swinging. It’s based on land. A revolutionary wants land so he can set up his own nation, an independent nation. These Negroes aren’t asking for no nation. They’re trying to crawl back on the plantation.

When you want a nation, that’s called nationalism. When the white man became involved in a revolution in this country against England, what was it for? He wanted this land so he could set up another white nation. That’s white nationalism. The American Revolution was white nationalism. The French Revolution was white nationalism. The Russian Revolution too —— yes, it was —— white nationalism. You don’t think so? Why [do] you think Khrushchev and Mao can’t get their heads together? White nationalism. All the revolutions that’s going on in Asia and Africa today are based on what? Black nationalism. A revolutionary is a black nationalist. He wants a nation. I was reading some beautiful words by Reverend Cleage, pointing out why he couldn’t get together with someone else here in the city because all of them were afraid of being identified with black nationalism. If you’re afraid of black nationalism, you’re afraid of revolution. And if you love revolution, you love black nationalism.

To understand this, you have to go back to what [the] young brother here referred to as the house Negro and the field Negro —— back during slavery. There was two kinds of slaves. There was the house Negro and the field Negro. The house Negroes — they lived in the house with master, they dressed pretty good, they ate good ’cause they ate his food —— what he left. They lived in the attic or the basement, but still they lived near the master; and they loved their master more than the master loved himself. They would give their life to save the master’s house quicker than the master would. The house Negro, if the master said, "We got a good house here," the house Negro would say, "Yeah, we got a good house here." Whenever the master said "we," he said "we." That’s how you can tell a house Negro.

If the master’s house caught on fire, the house Negro would fight harder to put the blaze out than the master would. If the master got sick, the house Negro would say, "What’s the matter, boss, we sick?" We sick! He identified himself with his master more than his master identified with himself. And if you came to the house Negro and said, "Let’s run away, let’s escape, let’s separate," the house Negro would look at you and say, "Man, you crazy. What you mean, separate? Where is there a better house than this? Where can I wear better clothes than this? Where can I eat better food than this?" That was that house Negro. In those days he was called a "house nigger." And that’s what we call him today, because we’ve still got some house niggers running around here.

This modern house Negro loves his master. He wants to live near him. He’ll pay three times as much as the house is worth just to live near his master, and then brag about "I’m the only Negro out here." "I’m the only one on my job." "I’m the only one in this school." You’re nothing but a house Negro. And if someone comes to you right now and says, "Let’s separate," you say the same thing that the house Negro said on the plantation. "What you mean, separate? From America? This good white man? Where you going to get a better job than you get here?" I mean, this is what you say. "I ain’t left nothing in Africa," that’s what you say. Why, you left your mind in Africa.

On that same plantation, there was the field Negro. The field Negro —— those were the masses. There were always more Negroes in the field than there was Negroes in the house. The Negro in the field caught hell. He ate leftovers. In the house they ate high up on the hog. The Negro in the field didn’t get nothing but what was left of the insides of the hog. They call ’em "chitt’lin’" nowadays. In those days they called them what they were: guts. That’s what you were —— a gut—eater. And some of you all still gut—eaters.

The field Negro was beaten from morning to night. He lived in a shack, in a hut; He wore old, castoff clothes. He hated his master. I say he hated his master. He was intelligent. That house Negro loved his master. But that field Negro —— remember, they were in the majority, and they hated the master. When the house caught on fire, he didn’t try and put it out; that field Negro prayed for a wind, for a breeze. When the master got sick, the field Negro prayed that he’d die. If someone come [sic] to the field Negro and said, "Let’s separate, let’s run," he didn’t say "Where we going?" He’d say, "Any place is better than here." You’ve got field Negroes in America today. I’m a field Negro. The masses are the field Negroes. When they see this man’s house on fire, you don’t hear these little Negroes talking about "our government is in trouble." They say, "The government is in trouble." Imagine a Negro: "Our government"! I even heard one say "our astronauts." They won’t even let him near the plant —— and "our astronauts"! "Our Navy" —— that’s a Negro that’s out of his mind. That’s a Negro that’s out of his mind.

Just as the slavemaster of that day used Tom, the house Negro, to keep the field Negroes in check, the same old slavemaster today has Negroes who are nothing but modern Uncle Toms, 20th century Uncle Toms, to keep you and me in check, keep us under control, keep us passive and peaceful and nonviolent. That’s Tom making you nonviolent. It’s like when you go to the dentist, and the man’s going to take your tooth. You’re going to fight him when he starts pulling. So he squirts some stuff in your jaw called novocaine, to make you think they’re not doing anything to you. So you sit there and ’cause you’ve got all of that novocaine in your jaw, you suffer peacefully. Blood running all down your jaw, and you don’t know what’s happening. ’Cause someone has taught you to suffer —— peacefully.

The white man do the same thing to you in the street, when he want [sic] to put knots on your head and take advantage of you and don’t have to be afraid of your fighting back. To keep you from fighting back, he gets these old religious Uncle Toms to teach you and me, just like novocaine, suffer peacefully. Don’t stop suffering —— just suffer peacefully. As Reverend Cleage pointed out, "Let your blood flow In the streets." This is a shame. And you know he’s a Christian preacher. If it’s a shame to him, you know what it is to me.

There’s nothing in our book, the Quran —— you call it "Ko—ran" —— that teaches us to suffer peacefully. Our religion teaches us to be intelligent. Be peaceful, be courteous, obey the law, respect everyone; but if someone puts his hand on you, send him to the cemetery. That’s a good religion. In fact, that’s that old—time religion. That’s the one that Ma and Pa used to talk about: an eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth, and a head for a head, and a life for a life: That’s a good religion. And doesn’t nobody resent that kind of religion being taught but a wolf, who intends to make you his meal.

This is the way it is with the white man in America. He’s a wolf and you’re sheep. Any time a shepherd, a pastor, teach [sic] you and me not to run from the white man and, at the same time, teach [sic] us not to fight the white man, he’s a traitor to you and me. Don’t lay down our life all by itself. No, preserve your life. it’s the best thing you got. And if you got to give it up, let it be even—steven.

The slavemaster took Tom and dressed him well, and fed him well, and even gave him a little education —— a little education; gave him a long coat and a top hat and made all the other slaves look up to him. Then he used Tom to control them. The same strategy that was used in those days is used today, by the same white man. He takes a Negro, a so—called Negro, and make [sic] him prominent, build [sic] him up, publicize [sic] him, make [sic] him a celebrity. And then he becomes a spokesman for Negroes —— and a Negro leader.

I would like to just mention just one other thing else quickly, and that is the method that the white man uses, how the white man uses these "big guns," or Negro leaders, against the black revolution. They are not a part of the black revolution. They’re used against the black revolution.

When Martin Luther King failed to desegregate Albany, Georgia, the civil—rights struggle in America reached its low point. King became bankrupt almost, as a leader. Plus, even financially, the Southern Christian Leadership Conference was in financial trouble; plus it was in trouble, period, with the people when they failed to desegregate Albany, Georgia. Other Negro civil—rights leaders of so—called national stature became fallen idols. As they became fallen idols, began to lose their prestige and influence, local Negro leaders began to stir up the masses. In Cambridge, Maryland, Gloria Richardson; in Danville, Virginia, and other parts of the country, local leaders began to stir up our people at the grassroots level. This was never done by these Negroes, whom you recognize, of national stature. They controlled you, but they never incited you or excited you. They controlled you; they contained you; they kept you on the plantation.

As soon as King failed in Birmingham, Negroes took to the streets. King got out and went out to California to a big rally and raised about —— I don’t know how many thousands of dollars. [He] come [sic] to Detroit and had a march and raised some more thousands of dollars. And recall, right after that [Roy] Wilkins attacked King, accused King and the CORE [Congress Of Racial Equality] of starting trouble everywhere and then making the NAACP [National Association for the Advancement of Colored People] get them out of jail and spend a lot of money; and then they accused King and CORE of raising all the money and not paying it back. This happened; I’ve got it in documented evidence in the newspaper. Roy started attacking King, and King started attacking Roy, and Farmer started attacking both of them. And as these Negroes of national stature began to attack each other, they began to lose their control of the Negro masses.

And Negroes was [sic] out there in the streets. They was [sic] talking about [how] we was [sic] going to march on Washington. By the way, right at that time Birmingham had exploded, and the Negroes in Birmingham —— remember, they also exploded. They began to stab the crackers in the back and bust them up ’side their head —— yes, they did. That’s when Kennedy sent in the troops, down in Birmingham. So, and right after that, Kennedy got on the television and said "this is a moral issue." That’s when he said he was going to put out a civil—rights bill. And when he mentioned civil—rights bill and the Southern crackers started talking about [how] they were going to boycott or filibuster it, then the Negroes started talking —— about what? We’re going to march on Washington, march on the Senate, march on the White House, march on the Congress, and tie it up, bring it to a halt; don’t let the government proceed. They even said they was [sic] going out to the airport and lay down on the runway and don’t let no airplanes land. I’m telling you what they said. That was revolution. That was revolution. That was the black revolution.

It was the grass roots out there in the street. [It] scared the white man to death, scared the white power structure in Washington, D. C. to death; I was there. When they found out that this black steamroller was going to come down on the capital, they called in Wilkins; they called in Randolph; they called in these national Negro leaders that you respect and told them, "Call it off." Kennedy said, "Look, you all letting this thing go too far." And Old Tom said, "Boss, I can’t stop it, because I didn’t start it." I’m telling you what they said. They said, "I’m not even in it, much less at the head of it." They said, "These Negroes are doing things on their own. They’re running ahead of us." And that old shrewd fox, he said, "Well If you all aren’t in it, I’ll put you in it. I’ll put you at the head of it. I’ll endorse it. I’ll welcome it. I’ll help it. I’ll join it."

A matter of hours went by. They had a meeting at the Carlyle Hotel in New York City. The Carlyle Hotel is owned by the Kennedy family; that’s the hotel Kennedy spent the night at, two nights ago; [it] belongs to his family. A philanthropic society headed by a white man named Stephen Currier called all the top civil—rights leaders together at the Carlyle Hotel. And he told them that, "By you all fighting each other, you are destroying the civil—rights movement. And since you’re fighting over money from white liberals, let us set up what is known as the Council for United Civil Rights Leadership. Let’s form this council, and all the civil—rights organizations will belong to it, and we’ll use it for fund—raising purposes." Let me show you how tricky the white man is. And as soon as they got it formed, they elected Whitney Young as the chairman, and who [do] you think became the co—chairman? Stephen Currier, the white man, a millionaire. Powell was talking about it down at the Cobo [Hall] today. This is what he was talking about. Powell knows it happened. Randolph knows it happened. Wilkins knows it happened. King knows it happened. Everyone of that so—called Big Six —— they know what happened.

Once they formed it, with the white man over it, he promised them and gave them $800,000 to split up between the Big Six; and told them that after the march was over they’d give them $700,000 more. A million and a half dollars —— split up between leaders that you’ve been following, going to jail for, crying crocodile tears for. And they’re nothing but Frank James and Jesse James and the what—do—you—call—’em brothers.

[As] soon as they got the setup organized, the white man made available to them top public relations experts; opened the news media across the country at their disposal; and then they begin [sic] to project these Big Six as the leaders of the march. Originally, they weren’t even in the march. You was [sic ] talking this march talk on Hastings Street —— Is Hastings Street still here? —— on Hasting Street. You was [sic] talking the march talk on Lenox Avenue, and out on —— What you call it? —— Fillmore Street, and Central Avenue, and 32nd Street and 63rd Street. That’s where the march talk was being talked. But the white man put the Big Six [at the] head of it; made them the march. They became the march. They took it over. And the first move they made after they took it over, they invited Walter Reuther, a white man; they invited a priest, a rabbi, and an old white preacher. Yes, an old white preacher. The same white element that put Kennedy in power —— labor, the Catholics, the Jews, and liberal Protestants; [the] same clique that put Kennedy in power, joined the march on Washington.

It’s just like when you’ve got some coffee that’s too black, which means it’s too strong. What you do? You integrate it with cream; you make it weak. If you pour too much cream in, you won’t even know you ever had coffee. It used to be hot, it becomes cool. It used to be strong, it becomes weak. It used to wake you up, now it’ll put you to sleep. This is what they did with the march on Washington. They joined it. They didn’t integrate it; they infiltrated it. They joined it, became a part of it, took it over. And as they took it over, it lost its militancy. They ceased to be angry. They ceased to be hot. They ceased to be uncompromising. Why, it even ceased to be a march. It became a picnic, a circus. Nothing but a circus, with clowns and all. You had one right here in Detroit —— I saw it on television —— with clowns leading it, white clowns and black clowns. I know you don’t like what I’m saying, but I’m going to tell you anyway. ’Cause I can prove what I’m saying. If you think I’m telling you wrong, you bring me Martin Luther King and A. Philip Randolph and James Farmer and those other three, and see if they’ll deny it over a microphone.

No, it was a sellout. It was a takeover. When James Baldwin came in from Paris, they wouldn’t let him talk, ’cause they couldn’t make him go by the script. Burt Lancaster read the speech that Baldwin was supposed to make; they wouldn’t let Baldwin get up there, ’cause they know Baldwin’s liable to say anything. They controlled it so tight —— they told those Negroes what time to hit town, how to come, where to stop, what signs to carry, what song to sing, what speech they could make, and what speech they couldn’t make; and then told them to get out town by sundown. And everyone of those Toms was out of town by sundown. Now I know you don’t like my saying this. But I can back it up. It was a circus, a performance that beat anything Hollywood could ever do, the performance of the year. Reuther and those other three devils should get a Academy Award for the best actors ’cause they acted like they really loved Negroes and fooled a whole lot of Negroes. And the six Negro leaders should get an award too, for the best supporting cast.

http://www.teachingamericanhistory.org/library/index.asp?document=1145

Emiliano Zapata
12-18-2007, 12:57 PM
Great speech.

mickyk200
12-18-2007, 01:28 PM
Here's the Ballot or the Bullet...it goes on for about an hour but it has some revlence to our own struggle and the divide in republicanism today
http://youtube.com/watch?v=CRNciryImqg

Jerry_Corneilus
12-18-2007, 10:17 PM
Message to Grassroots

Malcolm X
October 10, 1963

We want to have just an off—the—cuff chat between you and me —— us. We want to talk right down to earth in a language that everybody here can easily understand. We all agree tonight, all of the speakers have agreed, that America has a very serious problem. Not only does America have a very serious problem, but our people have a very serious problem. America’s problem is us. We’re her problem. The only reason she has a problem is she doesn’t want us here. And every time you look at yourself, be you black, brown, red, or yellow —— a so—called Negro —— you represent a person who poses such a serious problem for America because you’re not wanted. Once you face this as a fact, then you can start plotting a course that will make you appear intelligent, instead of unintelligent.

What you and I need to do is learn to forget our differences. When we come together, we don’t come together as Baptists or Methodists. You don’t catch hell ’cause you’re a Baptist, and you don’t catch hell ’cause you’re a Methodist. You don’t catch hell ’cause you’re a Methodist or Baptist. You don’t catch hell because you’re a Democrat or a Republican. You don’t catch hell because you’re a Mason or an Elk. And you sure don’t catch hell ’cause you’re an American; ’cause if you was an American, you wouldn’t catch no hell. You catch hell ’cause you’re a black man. You catch hell, all of us catch hell, for the same reason.

So we are all black people, so—called Negroes, second—class citizens, ex—slaves. You are nothing but a [sic] ex—slave. You don’t like to be told that. But what else are you? You are ex—slaves. You didn’t come here on the "Mayflower." You came here on a slave ship —— in chains, like a horse, or a cow, or a chicken. And you were brought here by the people who came here on the "Mayflower." You were brought here by the so—called Pilgrims, or Founding Fathers. They were the ones who brought you here.

We have a common enemy. We have this in common: We have a common oppressor, a common exploiter, and a common discriminator. But once we all realize that we have this common enemy, then we unite on the basis of what we have in common. And what we have foremost in common is that enemy —— the white man. He’s an enemy to all of us. I know some of you all think that some of them aren’t enemies. Time will tell.

In Bandung back in, I think, 1954, was the first unity meeting in centuries of black people. And once you study what happened at the Bandung conference, and the results of the Bandung conference, it actually serves as a model for the same procedure you and I can use to get our problems solved. At Bandung all the nations came together. Their were dark nations from Africa and Asia. Some of them were Buddhists. Some of them were Muslim. Some of them were Christians. Some of them were Confucianists; some were atheists. Despite their religious differences, they came together. Some were communists; some were socialists; some were capitalists. Despite their economic and political differences, they came together. All of them were black, brown, red, or yellow.

The number—one thing that was not allowed to attend the Bandung conference was the white man. He couldn’t come. Once they excluded the white man, they found that they could get together. Once they kept him out, everybody else fell right in and fell in line. This is the thing that you and I have to understand. And these people who came together didn’t have nuclear weapons; they didn’t have jet planes; they didn’t have all of the heavy armaments that the white man has. But they had unity.

They were able to submerge their little petty differences and agree on one thing: That though one African came from Kenya and was being colonized by the Englishman, and another African came from the Congo and was being colonized by the Belgian, and another African came from Guinea and was being colonized by the French, and another came from Angola and was being colonized by the Portuguese. When they came to the Bandung conference, they looked at the Portuguese, and at the Frenchman, and at the Englishman, and at the other —— Dutchman —— and learned or realized that the one thing that all of them had in common: they were all from Europe, they were all Europeans, blond, blue—eyed and white—skinned. They began to recognize who their enemy was. The same man that was colonizing our people in Kenya was colonizing our people in the Congo. The same one in the Congo was colonizing our people in South Africa, and in Southern Rhodesia, and in Burma, and in India, and in Afghanistan, and in Pakistan. They realized all over the world where the dark man was being oppressed, he was being oppressed by the white man; where the dark man was being exploited, he was being exploited by the white man. So they got together under this basis —— that they had a common enemy.

And when you and I here in Detroit and in Michigan and in America who have been awakened today look around us, we too realize here in America we all have a common enemy, whether he’s in Georgia or Michigan, whether he’s in California or New York. He’s the same man: blue eyes and blond hair and pale skin —— same man. So what we have to do is what they did. They agreed to stop quarreling among themselves. Any little spat that they had, they’d settle it among themselves, go into a huddle —— don’t let the enemy know that you got [sic] a disagreement.

Instead of us airing our differences in public, we have to realize we’re all the same family. And when you have a family squabble, you don’t get out on the sidewalk. If you do, everybody calls you uncouth, unrefined, uncivilized, savage. If you don’t make it at home, you settle it at home; you get in the closet —— argue it out behind closed doors. And then when you come out on the street, you pose a common front, a united front. And this is what we need to do in the community, and in the city, and in the state. We need to stop airing our differences in front of the white man. Put the white man out of our meetings, number one, and then sit down and talk shop with each other. [That’s] all you gotta do.

I would like to make a few comments concerning the difference between the black revolution and the Negro revolution. There’s a difference. Are they both the same? And if they’re not, what is the difference? What is the difference between a black revolution and a Negro revolution? First, what is a revolution? Sometimes I’m inclined to believe that many of our people are using this word "revolution" loosely, without taking careful consideration [of] what this word actually means, and what its historic characteristics are. When you study the historic nature of revolutions, the motive of a revolution, the objective of a revolution, and the result of a revolution, and the methods used in a revolution, you may change words. You may devise another program. You may change your goal and you may change your mind.

Look at the American Revolution in 1776. That revolution was for what? For land. Why did they want land? Independence. How was it carried out? Bloodshed. Number one, it was based on land, the basis of independence. And the only way they could get it was bloodshed. The French Revolution —— what was it based on? The land—less against the landlord. What was it for? Land. How did they get it? Bloodshed. Was no love lost; was no compromise; was no negotiation. I’m telling you, you don’t know what a revolution is. ’Cause when you find out what it is, you’ll get back in the alley; you’ll get out of the way. The Russian Revolution —— what was it based on? Land. The land—less against the landlord. How did they bring it about? Bloodshed. You haven’t got a revolution that doesn’t involve bloodshed. And you’re afraid to bleed. I said, you’re afraid to bleed.

[As] long as the white man sent you to Korea, you bled. He sent you to Germany, you bled. He sent you to the South Pacific to fight the Japanese, you bled. You bleed for white people. But when it comes time to seeing your own churches being bombed and little black girls be murdered, you haven’t got no blood. You bleed when the white man says bleed; you bite when the white man says bite; and you bark when the white man says bark. I hate to say this about us, but it’s true. How are you going to be nonviolent in Mississippi, as violent as you were in Korea? How can you justify being nonviolent in Mississippi and Alabama, when your churches are being bombed, and your little girls are being murdered, and at the same time you’re going to violent with Hitler, and Tojo, and somebody else that you don’t even know?

If violence is wrong in America, violence is wrong abroad. If it’s wrong to be violent defending black women and black children and black babies and black men, then it’s wrong for America to draft us and make us violent abroad in defense of her. And if it is right for America to draft us, and teach us how to be violent in defense of her, then it is right for you and me to do whatever is necessary to defend our own people right here in this country.

The Chinese Revolution —— they wanted land. They threw the British out, along with the Uncle Tom Chinese. Yeah, they did. They set a good example. When I was in prison, I read an article —— don’t be shocked when I say I was in prison. You’re still in prison. That’s what America means: prison. When I was in prison, I read an article in Life magazine showing a little Chinese girl, nine years old; her father was on his hands and knees and she was pulling the trigger ’cause he was an Uncle Tom Chinaman, When they had the revolution over there, they took a whole generation of Uncle Toms —— just wiped them out. And within ten years that little girl become [sic] a full—grown woman. No more Toms in China. And today it’s one of the toughest, roughest, most feared countries on this earth —— by the white man. ’Cause there are no Uncle Toms over there.

Of all our studies, history is best qualified to reward our research. And when you see that you’ve got problems, all you have to do is examine the historic method used all over the world by others who have problems similar to yours. And once you see how they got theirs straight, then you know how you can get yours straight. There’s been a revolution, a black revolution, going on in Africa. In Kenya, the Mau Mau were revolutionaries; they were the ones who made the word " Uhuru" [Kenyan word for "freedom"]. They were the ones who brought it to the fore.The Mau Mau, they were revolutionaries. They believed in scorched earth. They knocked everything aside that got in their way, and their revolution also was based on land, a desire for land. In Algeria, the northern part of Africa, a revolution took place. The Algerians were revolutionists; they wanted land. France offered to let them be integrated into France. They told France: to hell with France. They wanted some land, not some France. And they engaged in a bloody battle.

So I cite these various revolutions, brothers and sisters, to show you —— you don’t have a peaceful revolution. You don’t have a turn—the—other—cheek revolution. There’s no such thing as a nonviolent revolution. [The] only kind of revolution that’s nonviolent is the Negro revolution. The only revolution based on loving your enemy is the Negro revolution. The only revolution in which the goal is a desegregated lunch counter, a desegregated theater, a desegregated park, and a desegregated public toilet; you can sit down next to white folks on the toilet. That’s no revolution. Revolution is based on land. Land is the basis of all independence. Land is the basis of freedom, justice, and equality.

The white man knows what a revolution is. He knows that the black revolution is world—wide in scope and in nature. The black revolution is sweeping Asia, sweeping Africa, is rearing its head in Latin America. The Cuban Revolution —— that’s a revolution. They overturned the system. Revolution is in Asia. Revolution is in Africa. And the white man is screaming because he sees revolution in Latin America. How do you think he’ll react to you when you learn what a real revolution is? You don’t know what a revolution is. If you did, you wouldn’t use that word.

A revolution is bloody. Revolution is hostile. Revolution knows no compromise. Revolution overturns and destroys everything that gets in its way. And you, sitting around here like a knot on the wall, saying, "I’m going to love these folks no matter how much they hate me." No, you need a revolution. Whoever heard of a revolution where they lock arms, as Reverend Cleage was pointing out beautifully, singing "We Shall Overcome"? Just tell me. You don’t do that in a revolution. You don’t do any singing; you’re too busy swinging. It’s based on land. A revolutionary wants land so he can set up his own nation, an independent nation. These Negroes aren’t asking for no nation. They’re trying to crawl back on the plantation.

When you want a nation, that’s called nationalism. When the white man became involved in a revolution in this country against England, what was it for? He wanted this land so he could set up another white nation. That’s white nationalism. The American Revolution was white nationalism. The French Revolution was white nationalism. The Russian Revolution too —— yes, it was —— white nationalism. You don’t think so? Why [do] you think Khrushchev and Mao can’t get their heads together? White nationalism. All the revolutions that’s going on in Asia and Africa today are based on what? Black nationalism. A revolutionary is a black nationalist. He wants a nation. I was reading some beautiful words by Reverend Cleage, pointing out why he couldn’t get together with someone else here in the city because all of them were afraid of being identified with black nationalism. If you’re afraid of black nationalism, you’re afraid of revolution. And if you love revolution, you love black nationalism.

To understand this, you have to go back to what [the] young brother here referred to as the house Negro and the field Negro —— back during slavery. There was two kinds of slaves. There was the house Negro and the field Negro. The house Negroes — they lived in the house with master, they dressed pretty good, they ate good ’cause they ate his food —— what he left. They lived in the attic or the basement, but still they lived near the master; and they loved their master more than the master loved himself. They would give their life to save the master’s house quicker than the master would. The house Negro, if the master said, "We got a good house here," the house Negro would say, "Yeah, we got a good house here." Whenever the master said "we," he said "we." That’s how you can tell a house Negro.

If the master’s house caught on fire, the house Negro would fight harder to put the blaze out than the master would. If the master got sick, the house Negro would say, "What’s the matter, boss, we sick?" We sick! He identified himself with his master more than his master identified with himself. And if you came to the house Negro and said, "Let’s run away, let’s escape, let’s separate," the house Negro would look at you and say, "Man, you crazy. What you mean, separate? Where is there a better house than this? Where can I wear better clothes than this? Where can I eat better food than this?" That was that house Negro. In those days he was called a "house nigger." And that’s what we call him today, because we’ve still got some house niggers running around here.

This modern house Negro loves his master. He wants to live near him. He’ll pay three times as much as the house is worth just to live near his master, and then brag about "I’m the only Negro out here." "I’m the only one on my job." "I’m the only one in this school." You’re nothing but a house Negro. And if someone comes to you right now and says, "Let’s separate," you say the same thing that the house Negro said on the plantation. "What you mean, separate? From America? This good white man? Where you going to get a better job than you get here?" I mean, this is what you say. "I ain’t left nothing in Africa," that’s what you say. Why, you left your mind in Africa.

On that same plantation, there was the field Negro. The field Negro —— those were the masses. There were always more Negroes in the field than there was Negroes in the house. The Negro in the field caught hell. He ate leftovers. In the house they ate high up on the hog. The Negro in the field didn’t get nothing but what was left of the insides of the hog. They call ’em "chitt’lin’" nowadays. In those days they called them what they were: guts. That’s what you were —— a gut—eater. And some of you all still gut—eaters.

The field Negro was beaten from morning to night. He lived in a shack, in a hut; He wore old, castoff clothes. He hated his master. I say he hated his master. He was intelligent. That house Negro loved his master. But that field Negro —— remember, they were in the majority, and they hated the master. When the house caught on fire, he didn’t try and put it out; that field Negro prayed for a wind, for a breeze. When the master got sick, the field Negro prayed that he’d die. If someone come [sic] to the field Negro and said, "Let’s separate, let’s run," he didn’t say "Where we going?" He’d say, "Any place is better than here." You’ve got field Negroes in America today. I’m a field Negro. The masses are the field Negroes. When they see this man’s house on fire, you don’t hear these little Negroes talking about "our government is in trouble." They say, "The government is in trouble." Imagine a Negro: "Our government"! I even heard one say "our astronauts." They won’t even let him near the plant —— and "our astronauts"! "Our Navy" —— that’s a Negro that’s out of his mind. That’s a Negro that’s out of his mind.

Just as the slavemaster of that day used Tom, the house Negro, to keep the field Negroes in check, the same old slavemaster today has Negroes who are nothing but modern Uncle Toms, 20th century Uncle Toms, to keep you and me in check, keep us under control, keep us passive and peaceful and nonviolent. That’s Tom making you nonviolent. It’s like when you go to the dentist, and the man’s going to take your tooth. You’re going to fight him when he starts pulling. So he squirts some stuff in your jaw called novocaine, to make you think they’re not doing anything to you. So you sit there and ’cause you’ve got all of that novocaine in your jaw, you suffer peacefully. Blood running all down your jaw, and you don’t know what’s happening. ’Cause someone has taught you to suffer —— peacefully.

The white man do the same thing to you in the street, when he want [sic] to put knots on your head and take advantage of you and don’t have to be afraid of your fighting back. To keep you from fighting back, he gets these old religious Uncle Toms to teach you and me, just like novocaine, suffer peacefully. Don’t stop suffering —— just suffer peacefully. As Reverend Cleage pointed out, "Let your blood flow In the streets." This is a shame. And you know he’s a Christian preacher. If it’s a shame to him, you know what it is to me.

There’s nothing in our book, the Quran —— you call it "Ko—ran" —— that teaches us to suffer peacefully. Our religion teaches us to be intelligent. Be peaceful, be courteous, obey the law, respect everyone; but if someone puts his hand on you, send him to the cemetery. That’s a good religion. In fact, that’s that old—time religion. That’s the one that Ma and Pa used to talk about: an eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth, and a head for a head, and a life for a life: That’s a good religion. And doesn’t nobody resent that kind of religion being taught but a wolf, who intends to make you his meal.

This is the way it is with the white man in America. He’s a wolf and you’re sheep. Any time a shepherd, a pastor, teach [sic] you and me not to run from the white man and, at the same time, teach [sic] us not to fight the white man, he’s a traitor to you and me. Don’t lay down our life all by itself. No, preserve your life. it’s the best thing you got. And if you got to give it up, let it be even—steven.

The slavemaster took Tom and dressed him well, and fed him well, and even gave him a little education —— a little education; gave him a long coat and a top hat and made all the other slaves look up to him. Then he used Tom to control them. The same strategy that was used in those days is used today, by the same white man. He takes a Negro, a so—called Negro, and make [sic] him prominent, build [sic] him up, publicize [sic] him, make [sic] him a celebrity. And then he becomes a spokesman for Negroes —— and a Negro leader.

I would like to just mention just one other thing else quickly, and that is the method that the white man uses, how the white man uses these "big guns," or Negro leaders, against the black revolution. They are not a part of the black revolution. They’re used against the black revolution.

When Martin Luther King failed to desegregate Albany, Georgia, the civil—rights struggle in America reached its low point. King became bankrupt almost, as a leader. Plus, even financially, the Southern Christian Leadership Conference was in financial trouble; plus it was in trouble, period, with the people when they failed to desegregate Albany, Georgia. Other Negro civil—rights leaders of so—called national stature became fallen idols. As they became fallen idols, began to lose their prestige and influence, local Negro leaders began to stir up the masses. In Cambridge, Maryland, Gloria Richardson; in Danville, Virginia, and other parts of the country, local leaders began to stir up our people at the grassroots level. This was never done by these Negroes, whom you recognize, of national stature. They controlled you, but they never incited you or excited you. They controlled you; they contained you; they kept you on the plantation.

As soon as King failed in Birmingham, Negroes took to the streets. King got out and went out to California to a big rally and raised about —— I don’t know how many thousands of dollars. [He] come [sic] to Detroit and had a march and raised some more thousands of dollars. And recall, right after that [Roy] Wilkins attacked King, accused King and the CORE [Congress Of Racial Equality] of starting trouble everywhere and then making the NAACP [National Association for the Advancement of Colored People] get them out of jail and spend a lot of money; and then they accused King and CORE of raising all the money and not paying it back. This happened; I’ve got it in documented evidence in the newspaper. Roy started attacking King, and King started attacking Roy, and Farmer started attacking both of them. And as these Negroes of national stature began to attack each other, they began to lose their control of the Negro masses.

And Negroes was [sic] out there in the streets. They was [sic] talking about [how] we was [sic] going to march on Washington. By the way, right at that time Birmingham had exploded, and the Negroes in Birmingham —— remember, they also exploded. They began to stab the crackers in the back and bust them up ’side their head —— yes, they did. That’s when Kennedy sent in the troops, down in Birmingham. So, and right after that, Kennedy got on the television and said "this is a moral issue." That’s when he said he was going to put out a civil—rights bill. And when he mentioned civil—rights bill and the Southern crackers started talking about [how] they were going to boycott or filibuster it, then the Negroes started talking —— about what? We’re going to march on Washington, march on the Senate, march on the White House, march on the Congress, and tie it up, bring it to a halt; don’t let the government proceed. They even said they was [sic] going out to the airport and lay down on the runway and don’t let no airplanes land. I’m telling you what they said. That was revolution. That was revolution. That was the black revolution.

It was the grass roots out there in the street. [It] scared the white man to death, scared the white power structure in Washington, D. C. to death; I was there. When they found out that this black steamroller was going to come down on the capital, they called in Wilkins; they called in Randolph; they called in these national Negro leaders that you respect and told them, "Call it off." Kennedy said, "Look, you all letting this thing go too far." And Old Tom said, "Boss, I can’t stop it, because I didn’t start it." I’m telling you what they said. They said, "I’m not even in it, much less at the head of it." They said, "These Negroes are doing things on their own. They’re running ahead of us." And that old shrewd fox, he said, "Well If you all aren’t in it, I’ll put you in it. I’ll put you at the head of it. I’ll endorse it. I’ll welcome it. I’ll help it. I’ll join it."

A matter of hours went by. They had a meeting at the Carlyle Hotel in New York City. The Carlyle Hotel is owned by the Kennedy family; that’s the hotel Kennedy spent the night at, two nights ago; [it] belongs to his family. A philanthropic society headed by a white man named Stephen Currier called all the top civil—rights leaders together at the Carlyle Hotel. And he told them that, "By you all fighting each other, you are destroying the civil—rights movement. And since you’re fighting over money from white liberals, let us set up what is known as the Council for United Civil Rights Leadership. Let’s form this council, and all the civil—rights organizations will belong to it, and we’ll use it for fund—raising purposes." Let me show you how tricky the white man is. And as soon as they got it formed, they elected Whitney Young as the chairman, and who [do] you think became the co—chairman? Stephen Currier, the white man, a millionaire. Powell was talking about it down at the Cobo [Hall] today. This is what he was talking about. Powell knows it happened. Randolph knows it happened. Wilkins knows it happened. King knows it happened. Everyone of that so—called Big Six —— they know what happened.

Once they formed it, with the white man over it, he promised them and gave them $800,000 to split up between the Big Six; and told them that after the march was over they’d give them $700,000 more. A million and a half dollars —— split up between leaders that you’ve been following, going to jail for, crying crocodile tears for. And they’re nothing but Frank James and Jesse James and the what—do—you—call—’em brothers.

[As] soon as they got the setup organized, the white man made available to them top public relations experts; opened the news media across the country at their disposal; and then they begin [sic] to project these Big Six as the leaders of the march. Originally, they weren’t even in the march. You was [sic ] talking this march talk on Hastings Street —— Is Hastings Street still here? —— on Hasting Street. You was [sic] talking the march talk on Lenox Avenue, and out on —— What you call it? —— Fillmore Street, and Central Avenue, and 32nd Street and 63rd Street. That’s where the march talk was being talked. But the white man put the Big Six [at the] head of it; made them the march. They became the march. They took it over. And the first move they made after they took it over, they invited Walter Reuther, a white man; they invited a priest, a rabbi, and an old white preacher. Yes, an old white preacher. The same white element that put Kennedy in power —— labor, the Catholics, the Jews, and liberal Protestants; [the] same clique that put Kennedy in power, joined the march on Washington.

It’s just like when you’ve got some coffee that’s too black, which means it’s too strong. What you do? You integrate it with cream; you make it weak. If you pour too much cream in, you won’t even know you ever had coffee. It used to be hot, it becomes cool. It used to be strong, it becomes weak. It used to wake you up, now it’ll put you to sleep. This is what they did with the march on Washington. They joined it. They didn’t integrate it; they infiltrated it. They joined it, became a part of it, took it over. And as they took it over, it lost its militancy. They ceased to be angry. They ceased to be hot. They ceased to be uncompromising. Why, it even ceased to be a march. It became a picnic, a circus. Nothing but a circus, with clowns and all. You had one right here in Detroit —— I saw it on television —— with clowns leading it, white clowns and black clowns. I know you don’t like what I’m saying, but I’m going to tell you anyway. ’Cause I can prove what I’m saying. If you think I’m telling you wrong, you bring me Martin Luther King and A. Philip Randolph and James Farmer and those other three, and see if they’ll deny it over a microphone.

No, it was a sellout. It was a takeover. When James Baldwin came in from Paris, they wouldn’t let him talk, ’cause they couldn’t make him go by the script. Burt Lancaster read the speech that Baldwin was supposed to make; they wouldn’t let Baldwin get up there, ’cause they know Baldwin’s liable to say anything. They controlled it so tight —— they told those Negroes what time to hit town, how to come, where to stop, what signs to carry, what song to sing, what speech they could make, and what speech they couldn’t make; and then told them to get out town by sundown. And everyone of those Toms was out of town by sundown. Now I know you don’t like my saying this. But I can back it up. It was a circus, a performance that beat anything Hollywood could ever do, the performance of the year. Reuther and those other three devils should get a Academy Award for the best actors ’cause they acted like they really loved Negroes and fooled a whole lot of Negroes. And the six Negro leaders should get an award too, for the best supporting cast.

http://www.teachingamericanhistory.org/library/index.asp?document=1145




I don't understand why the IRSP are intrested in someone whos world opinion was based upon race and religion and not class.

Note no mention of the fact black slavery existed before Whites ever got to Africa, nor Islams role in it.

Puddies
12-18-2007, 11:14 PM
I don't understand why the IRSP are intrested in someone whos world opinion was based upon race and religion and not class.

Note no mention of the fact black slavery existed before Whites ever got to Africa, nor Islams role in it.Malcolm X broke his connections to the Black Muslim movement and condemned all forms of racism before his death. He was also once a peddler of drugs who spent his days in Harlem hanging out with pimps and prostitutes. People change...Malcolm stated that there would be a clash between the oppressed and the oppressors and it wouldn't be based on race.

He was a Revolutionary and I believe personally that the ideas and principles that he formulated are relevant to anyone any where.

Takeshi
12-19-2007, 04:02 AM
"The common enemy is the white man."
Malcolm X

Puddies
12-19-2007, 04:44 AM
"The common enemy is the white man."
Malcolm XAnd what is the context of that statement? It was while Malcolm was involved with the Nation of Islam. In between the period when he was a drug dealing hustler and the period when he gave this speech. If you didn't know already, he was a follower of the racist leader of the NoI, Elijah Muhammad, who he would later condemn as such.

People change and can be confused about things, isn't it true that a large amount of people from the north of Ireland have been deceived into believing that their common enemy is Protestants? Malcolm X was incorrect when he made the statement you quoted and he would acknowledge that.

"I am not a racist.... In the past I permitted myself to be used...to make sweeping indictments of all white people, the entire white race and these generalizations have caused injuries to some whites who perhaps did not deserve to be hurt."

Malcolm X

Jerry_Corneilus
12-19-2007, 10:24 AM
Malcolm X broke his connections to the Black Muslim movement and condemned all forms of racism before his death. He was also once a peddler of drugs who spent his days in Harlem hanging out with pimps and prostitutes. People change...Malcolm stated that there would be a clash between the oppressed and the oppressors and it wouldn't be based on race.

He was a Revolutionary and I believe personally that the ideas and principles that he formulated are relevant to anyone any where.


Yes, but he still saw himself first as a black Muslim, never as working class.

Hence he was able to pray alongside and meet rich Muslims and meet Muslim princes and Kings without any condemnation, while holding a negative opinion of all Whites, 99% of White people had nothing to do with slavery so blaming all White people is a form of racism in itself.

The guy was a narrow minded bigot who channelled his massive ego from crime into politics and religious extremism.

Puddies
12-19-2007, 03:00 PM
Yes, but he still saw himself first as a black Muslim, never as working class.

Hence he was able to pray alongside and meet rich Muslims and meet Muslim princes and Kings without any condemnation, while holding a negative opinion of all Whites, 99% of White people had nothing to do with slavery so blaming all White people is a form of racism in itself.

The guy was a narrow minded bigot who channelled his massive ego from crime into politics and religious extremism.I never said he was a perfect Marxist or indeed a Marxist at all. That doesn't mean we should attach a label to him and render all of the ideas he put forward as irrelevant. He was an extremely intelligent man and it is my belief that if his life had not been cut short he would have eventually seen the light when it comes to the working class.

I believe that his life is relevant to Ireland because many Irishmen have been in similar positions in the past and in the present. How many working class youths in say Belfast are involved in the drugs trade? And also how many working class youths from either community in the north are blatantly sectarian and bigoted? Do you believe that these people are just social scum with no hope, or do you believe that they can be transformed into conscious proletarians? If you're an advocate for the working class I would think you'd see the mass of these people as victims of the system and not enemies.

So yes Malcolm was a druggie at one point, yes he was a bigot at one point, but he would go on to learn the error of many of his ways. That still doesn't mean he was a perfect human being at the time of his death. I'd strongly recommend The Autobiography of Malcolm X to anyone.

Jerry, is there anything in this specific speech that you have a problem with?

Emiliano Zapata
12-19-2007, 03:04 PM
So yes Malcolm was a druggie at one point, yes he was a bigot at one point, but he would go on to learn the error of many of his ways. That still doesn't mean he was a perfect human being at the time of his death. I'd strongly recommend The Autobiography of Malcolm X to anyone.


yup its a great book, alex haley is an amazing writer.

Puddies
12-19-2007, 04:21 PM
Ah and I stand corrected from my earlier post since Malcolm X did in fact refer to the "white man" as the "common enemy" in this very piece. I think most here would agree that was a bigoted and misguided statement. However I can certainly understand how he would have jumped to that conclusion having been brought up in a society that was and still is to a lesser extent segregated by race. I think he would later acknowledge that most white people were largely oblivious to the reality that exists, just as blacks were raised to believe they were inferior whites were raised to believe that they superior.

We've progressed as a society a lot since 1963, but we're still told most every day that America is the greatest nation on the face of the Earth. That message usually either comes from bourgeois looking white men or women. Although on token occasions it will come from a bourgeois looking man or woman of color who suspiciously has exactly the same accent as their white colleagues.

Comrade Ryan
12-19-2007, 11:53 PM
In fairness this speech was during the period that Malcolm was still in the Nation of Islam. Before his transformation.

Even though many of Malcolms early speeches had statements which were mistaken politcally and racially I can understand where he was coming from. As someone who had led a fairly brutal life, where most if not all the white people he knew had explited or oppressed him, it is easy to see why he 'kicked back'. If I was in the same position, with my temperment, I probably would have done the same.

However, even in his many early speeches, there were some very progressive ideas. I just don't believe he had identified the correct enemy.

But as time went on he began to...

In Africa he met leaders of a number of victorious anti-colonial movements. A few weeks before his murder he recalled a conversation he had had with the Algerian ambassador to Ghana, “who is extremely militant and is a revolutionary in the truest sense of the word”.

Malcolm had told him his philosophy was “black nationalism”. But where did that leave the ambassador, who was white?

Malcolm continued, “Where does that leave revolutionaries in Morocco, Egypt, Iraq and Mauritania? So I had to do a lot of thinking and reappraising of my definition of black nationalism.”

At about the same time he said, “I don’t speak against the sincere, well meaning, good white people. I have learned that not all white people are racist.”

In the last year of his life Malcolm came to see the connection between different struggles across the globe. He said:

“We are living in an era of revolution, and the revolt of the American negro is part of the rebellion.

“We are today seeing a global struggle of the oppressed against the oppressor, the exploited against the exploiters.”

And he became a staunch anti-capitalist. He said, “Show me a capitalist and I’ll show you a bloodsucker” and “You can’t have capitalism without racism.”

He added, if you find someone who “makes you sure they do not have this racism in their outlook, usually they’re socialists”.

Malcolm X did not become a socialist. But he was a revolutionary, and that meant he had to look at how the oppressed and exploited could overthrow the system that holds them down.

He said, “You have whites who are fed up, you have blacks who are fed up. When the day comes when the whites who are really fed up learn how to establish the proper type of communication with those [blacks] who are fed up and they get some co-ordinated action going, you’ll get some changes. And it will take both, it will take everything that you’ve got.”

He believed such unity was desirable, but very difficult to achieve. The first step, he said, was to build a militant black organisation.

The prob is Puddies, that many white americans, can't see past their own hatred towards people like Malcolm and they will never recognise his truth, his life, how it transformed, and what could have been had he lived longer, simply because they are too bigoted to make sense out of his experiences.

Don't waste your breath mate.

Jerry_Corneilus
12-20-2007, 12:12 AM
Malcolm X was a black racialist who believed in racial segregation. Fact. Where did he recant his racial separatism ?

PLAYBOY: Do you feel that the Black Muslims' goal of obtaining "several states" is a practical vision?

MALCOLM X: Well, you might consider some things practical that are really impractical. Wasn't it impractical that the Supreme Court could issue a desegregation order nine years ago and there's still only eight percent compliance? Is it practical that a hundred years after the Civil War there's not freedom for black men yet? On the record for integration you've got the President, the Congress, the Supreme Court--but show me your integration, where is it? That's practical? Mr. Muhammad teaches us to be for what's really practical--that's separation. It's more natural than integration.

PLAYBOY: Are you referring to the Muslim judgment day which your organization's newspaper, MUHAMMAD SPEAKS, calls "Armageddon" and prophesies as imminent?

MALCOLM X: Armageddon deals with the final battle between God and the Devil. The Third World War is referred to as Armageddon by many white statesmen. There won't be any more war after then because there won't be any more warmongers. I don't know when Armageddon, whatever form it takes, is supposed to be. But I know the time is near when the white man will be finished. The signs are all around us. Ten years ago you couldn't have paid a Southern Negro to defy local customs. The British Lion's tail has been snatched off in black Africa. The Indonesians have booted out such would-be imperialists as the Dutch. The French, who felt for a century that Algeria was theirs, have had to run for their lives back to France. Sir, the point I make is that all over the world, the old day of standing in fear and trembling before the almighty white man is gone!

PLAYBOY: If Muslims ultimately gain control as you predict, what do you plan to do with white people?

MALCOLM X: It's not a case of what would we do, it's a case of what would God do with whites. What does a judge do with the guilty? Either the guilty one repents and atones, or God executes judgment.

PLAYBOY: You refer to whites as "the guilty" and "the enemy"; you predict divine retribution against them; and you preach absolute separation from the white community. Do not these views substantiate the fact that your movement is predicated on race hatred?

MALCOLM X: Sir, it's from Mr. Muhammad that the black masses are learning for the first time in 400 years the real truth of how the white man brainwashed the black man, kept him ignorant of his true history, robbed him of his self-confidence. The black masses for the first time are understanding that it's not a case of being anti-white or anti-Christian, but it's a case of seeing the true nature of the white man. We're anti-evil, anti-oppression, anti-lynching. You can't be anti-those things unless you're also anti-the oppressor and the lyncher. You can't be anti-slavery and pro-slavemaster; you can't be anti-crime and pro-criminal. In fact, Mr. Muhammad teaches that if the present generation of whites would study their own race in the light of their true history, they would be anti-white themselves.



http://www.malcolm-x.org/docs/int_playb.htm

Comrade Ryan
12-20-2007, 12:49 AM
Malcolm X was a black racialist who believed in racial segregation. Fact. Where did he recant his racial separatism ?

PLAYBOY: Do you feel that the Black Muslims' goal of obtaining "several states" is a practical vision?

MALCOLM X: Well, you might consider some things practical that are really impractical. Wasn't it impractical that the Supreme Court could issue a desegregation order nine years ago and there's still only eight percent compliance? Is it practical that a hundred years after the Civil War there's not freedom for black men yet? On the record for integration you've got the President, the Congress, the Supreme Court--but show me your integration, where is it? That's practical? Mr. Muhammad teaches us to be for what's really practical--that's separation. It's more natural than integration.

PLAYBOY: Are you referring to the Muslim judgment day which your organization's newspaper, MUHAMMAD SPEAKS, calls "Armageddon" and prophesies as imminent?

MALCOLM X: Armageddon deals with the final battle between God and the Devil. The Third World War is referred to as Armageddon by many white statesmen. There won't be any more war after then because there won't be any more warmongers. I don't know when Armageddon, whatever form it takes, is supposed to be. But I know the time is near when the white man will be finished. The signs are all around us. Ten years ago you couldn't have paid a Southern Negro to defy local customs. The British Lion's tail has been snatched off in black Africa. The Indonesians have booted out such would-be imperialists as the Dutch. The French, who felt for a century that Algeria was theirs, have had to run for their lives back to France. Sir, the point I make is that all over the world, the old day of standing in fear and trembling before the almighty white man is gone!

PLAYBOY: If Muslims ultimately gain control as you predict, what do you plan to do with white people?

MALCOLM X: It's not a case of what would we do, it's a case of what would God do with whites. What does a judge do with the guilty? Either the guilty one repents and atones, or God executes judgment.

PLAYBOY: You refer to whites as "the guilty" and "the enemy"; you predict divine retribution against them; and you preach absolute separation from the white community. Do not these views substantiate the fact that your movement is predicated on race hatred?

MALCOLM X: Sir, it's from Mr. Muhammad that the black masses are learning for the first time in 400 years the real truth of how the white man brainwashed the black man, kept him ignorant of his true history, robbed him of his self-confidence. The black masses for the first time are understanding that it's not a case of being anti-white or anti-Christian, but it's a case of seeing the true nature of the white man. We're anti-evil, anti-oppression, anti-lynching. You can't be anti-those things unless you're also anti-the oppressor and the lyncher. You can't be anti-slavery and pro-slavemaster; you can't be anti-crime and pro-criminal. In fact, Mr. Muhammad teaches that if the present generation of whites would study their own race in the light of their true history, they would be anti-white themselves.



http://www.malcolm-x.org/docs/int_playb.htm

What planet are you on? Have you not picked up on the fact that this was YET ANOTHER example prior to his leaving the Nation of Islam and prior to his transformation?

Is this too much for you to handle chara?

Comrade Ryan
12-20-2007, 12:57 AM
Malcolm X was a black racialist who believed in racial segregation. Fact. Where did he recant his racial separatism ?

How about his letter following his pilgrimage to Mecca?

"There were tens of thousands of pilgrims, from all over the world. They were of all colors, from blue-eyed blondes to black-skinned Africans. But we were all participating in the same ritual, displaying a spirit of unity and brotherhood that my experiences in America had led me to believe never could exist between the white and the non-white.

You may be shocked by these words coming from me. But on this pilgrimage, what I have seen, and experienced, has forced me to rearrange much of my thought patterns previously held, and to toss aside some of my previous conclusions. This was not too difficult for me. Despite my firm convictions, I have been always a man who tries to face facts, and to accept the reality of life as new experience and new knowledge unfolds it. I have always kept an open mind, which is necessary to the flexibility that must go hand in hand with every form of intelligent search for truth.

During the past eleven days here in the Muslim world, I have eaten from the same plate, drunk from the same glass and slept in the same bed (or on the same rug)-while praying to the same God with fellow Muslims, whose eyes were the bluest of the blue, whose hair was the blondest of blond, and whose skin was the whitest of white. And in the words and in the actions and in the deeds of the ‘white' Muslims, I felt the same sincerity that I felt among the black African Muslims of Nigeria, Sudan and Ghana.

We are truly all the same-brothers.

All praise is due to Allah, the Lord of the worlds."

Jerry_Corneilus
12-20-2007, 05:48 AM
So presumably for White working class people to have gained Malcolm Xs acceptance they must have become Muslim :rolleyes:

very progressive.

Never mind the fact women are excluded from the above rituals.


Malcolm X was preaching an oxymoron, an equality that excluded women and condeming slavery and inequality while preaching a religion that promoted it.

Maverick
12-20-2007, 06:47 AM
So presumably for White working class people to have gained Malcolm Xs acceptance they must have become Muslim :rolleyes:

very progressive.

Yep, and after you become a Muslim, You are expected to strap on a bomb
and go blow some thing up including your self, so you can be honored as a Martyr! If Malcom X was a live today, I wonder if he would go back to being
a Christian? :bow: :hmmm:

Calv
12-20-2007, 09:11 AM
Yep, and after you become a Muslim, You are expected to strap on a bomb
and go blow some thing up including your self, so you can be honored as a Martyr! If Malcom X was a live today, I wonder if he would go back to being
a Christian? :bow: :hmmm:

This is a fine example of what being in the US Army does to you. It gives you the deluded view that all Muslims are terrorists. I feel sorry for you, I really do.

greektzon
12-20-2007, 10:06 AM
What is your opinion about Black panthers?
Malcolm X fought only for his race i think.

ciaranxavier
12-20-2007, 10:18 AM
Yep, and after you become a Muslim, You are expected to strap on a bomb
and go blow some thing up including your self, so you can be honored as a Martyr! If Malcom X was a live today, I wonder if he would go back to being
a Christian? :bow: :hmmm:

where did you learn anything about being muslim. firstly the majority of the suicide bombers are islamic extremists not muslims. and i use extremists because the small amount of people who do do that warp islam to suit their needs which many have done over the ages for example the crusades. thousands of innocent muslims were slaughtered by christians for no reason much the same as the islamic extremists. and no malcolm x would not go back to being a christian and hed probably laugh in your face after hearing your ignorant comments, he was firmly rooted in his ideals. and ive read malcolm x's biography and if it werent for converting to muslim he wouldve hated the white man till the day he died, it was because of that religion that he learned to accept the white man as a whole on an equal level, and then root out the ones like you who continue to breed hate with their false accusations.

ciaranxavier
12-20-2007, 10:20 AM
What is your opinion about Black panthers?
Malcolm X fought only for his race i think.

i can see why people think your a neo nazi you really need to stop making everything into a race issue, i know your not attacking any race but not everything in life has to do with ones color and heritage. malcolm x fought to have equal rights as a whole no matter what your color was.

greektzon
12-20-2007, 10:33 AM
[QUOTE ciaranxavier i can see why people think your a neo nazi you really need to stop making everything into a race issue, i know your not attacking any race but not everything in life has to do with ones color and heritage. malcolm x fought to have equal rights as a whole no matter what your color was.[/QUOTE]

maybe you are right.So ,the word Race is prohibited,because the neo-nazis use it?And that means never in your life wont say the word Race,because you will afraid someone could call you ''fascist,or nazi?''

ciaranxavier
12-20-2007, 10:40 AM
[QUOTE ciaranxavier i can see why people think your a neo nazi you really need to stop making everything into a race issue, i know your not attacking any race but not everything in life has to do with ones color and heritage. malcolm x fought to have equal rights as a whole no matter what your color was.

maybe you are right.So ,the word Race is prohibited,because the neo-nazis use it?And that means never in your life wont say the word Race,because you will afraid someone could call you ''fascist,or nazi?''[/QUOTE]

no see what i said is that every topic ive seen you responding to in the last day has in some form or another involved race because you brought it up, i would just like to see you discussing it other ways as race is not very important especially in a debate. and i never called you one i just said i can see why people would think it. and i didnt say never its just when the topic pertains to it use it if not dont find a reason to bring race into it.

greektzon
12-20-2007, 12:06 PM
I would like to ask you something ciaranxavier.If i will tell (example,ok?)the black people are enemies,am i racist?

Comrade Ryan
12-20-2007, 12:29 PM
Yep, and after you become a Muslim, You are expected to strap on a bomb
and go blow some thing up including your self, so you can be honored as a Martyr! If Malcom X was a live today, I wonder if he would go back to being
a Christian? :bow: :hmmm:

What exactly are you doing here? Why would a bigot frequent such places?

Know much about suicide bombs do you?

Comrade Ryan
12-20-2007, 12:45 PM
So presumably for White working class people to have gained Malcolm Xs acceptance they must have become Muslim :rolleyes:

very progressive.

Never mind the fact women are excluded from the above rituals.

First off, where did it say that Malcolm demanded white people became muslims to gain his acceptance? I merely posted that excerpt from his letter to answer your call to supply something which showed Malcolm recanted his earlier calls for racial seperation. I notice you have not dealt with that point again. I'm glad it is put to bed.

People did not have to be muslims to gain malcolms acceptance. Read up on a group malcolm founded after his transformation called Afro-American Unity. It wa sa secular organisation aimed at bringing together different strands of African American society to agitate together.

And don't be going on about rituals as if only muslims exclude women. Wasn't too long ago the catholic faith wouldn't allow women to give the eucharist, etc. Women have been denied the right to take full part in many rituals, to give and recieve, and from being priests.

Many religions discriminate against women.

Comrade Ryan
12-20-2007, 12:49 PM
where did you learn anything about being muslim. firstly the majority of the suicide bombers are islamic extremists not muslims. and i use extremists because the small amount of people who do do that warp islam to suit their needs which many have done over the ages for example the crusades. thousands of innocent muslims were slaughtered by christians for no reason much the same as the islamic extremists. and no malcolm x would not go back to being a christian and hed probably laugh in your face after hearing your ignorant comments, he was firmly rooted in his ideals. and ive read malcolm x's biography and if it werent for converting to muslim he wouldve hated the white man till the day he died, it was because of that religion that he learned to accept the white man as a whole on an equal level, and then root out the ones like you who continue to breed hate with their false accusations.

The majority of suicide bombers aren't even islamic extremists. The majority are tamil tigers and marxist. But history is replete with examples of suicide operations, including Japanese Kamikaze pilots. So to try and bring some inherent link between islam and suicide attacks is totally incorrect.

Comrade Ryan
12-20-2007, 12:50 PM
I would like to ask you something ciaranxavier.If i will tell (example,ok?)the black people are enemies,am i racist?

Can I cut in?

It depends. Why would you say they are enemies?

greektzon
12-20-2007, 01:42 PM
Can I cut in?

It depends. Why would you say they are enemies?

Because i read Malcolm x said their enemies are all the white people.So,he was racist?

Emiliano Zapata
12-20-2007, 02:06 PM
Because i read Malcolm x said their enemies are all the white people.So,he was racist?

"I am not a racist. I am against every form of racism and segregation, every form of discrimination. I believe in human beings, and that all human beings should be respected as such, regardless of their color." Malcolm X

"I am not a racist.... In the past I permitted myself to be used...to make sweeping indictments of all white people, the entire white race and these generalizations have caused injuries to some whites who perhaps did not deserve to be hurt. Because of the spiritual enlightenment which I was blessed to receive as a result of my recent pilgrimage to the Holy city of Mecca, I no longer subscribe to sweeping indictments of any one race. I am now striving to live the life of a true...Muslim. I must repeat that I am not a racist nor do I subscribe to the tenants of racism. I can state in all sincerity that I wish nothing but freedom, justice and equality, life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness for all people." Malcolm X

Like it has already been stated in this thread he WAS racist at one point in his life but later in his life he changed his views regarding race.

Jerry_Corneilus
12-20-2007, 02:28 PM
First off, where did it say that Malcolm demanded white people became muslims to gain his acceptance? I merely posted that excerpt from his letter to answer your call to supply something which showed Malcolm recanted his earlier calls for racial seperation. I notice you have not dealt with that point again. I'm glad it is put to bed.

People did not have to be muslims to gain malcolms acceptance. Read up on a group malcolm founded after his transformation called Afro-American Unity. It wa sa secular organisation aimed at bringing together different strands of African American society to agitate together.

And don't be going on about rituals as if only muslims exclude women. Wasn't too long ago the catholic faith wouldn't allow women to give the eucharist, etc. Women have been denied the right to take full part in many rituals, to give and recieve, and from being priests.

Many religions discriminate against women.



Yes but if someone came on here advocating traditional Catholicism as a means of solving societies problems I bet you would slate them.

Malcolm X was a walking contradiction, he dropped the racial separatism for sectarianism, stating he wanted Muslim only states in the US.

So the question remains, what has this got to do with socialism ?

And as for claiming Islam and Catholicism both discriminate against women, thats a lame answer and evades the fact Malcolm X was promoting the later.

The fact he was also part White and some claim gay, shows what contradiction he actually was.

greektzon
12-20-2007, 02:46 PM
Thank you Republican_Socialist for your posts.
I read Malcolm X and George Lincoln Rocwell were friends each other.Is it true or not?
http://img503.imageshack.us/img503/6931/malcom500500ri6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Puddies
12-20-2007, 02:50 PM
Yes but if someone came on here advocating traditional Catholicism as a means of solving societies problems I bet you would slate them.

Malcolm X was a walking contradiction, he dropped the racial separatism for sectarianism, stating he wanted Muslim only states in the US.

So the question remains, what has this got to do with socialism ?

And as for claiming Islam and Catholicism both discriminate against women, thats a lame answer and evades the fact Malcolm X was promoting the later.

The fact he was also part White and some claim gay, shows what contradiction he actually was.Everybody is a walking contradiction comrade...

Emiliano Zapata
12-20-2007, 03:03 PM
Thank you Republican_Socialist for your posts.
I read Malcolm X and George Lincoln Rocwell were friends each other.Is it true or not?
http://img503.imageshack.us/img503/6931/malcom500500ri6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Telegram to George Lincoln Rockwell (Leader of the American Nazi Party)
by Malcolm X

1965

This is to warn you that I am no longer held in check from fighting white supremacists by Elijah Muhammad's separatist Black Muslim movement, and that if your present racist agitation against our people there in Alabama causes physical harm to Reverend King or any other black Americans who are only attempting to enjoy their rights as free human beings, that you and your Ku Klux Klan friends will be met with maximum physical retaliation from those of us who are not hand-cuffed by the disarming philosophy of nonviolence, and who believe in asserting our right of self-defense -- by any means necessary.

Comrade Ryan
12-20-2007, 03:23 PM
Because i read Malcolm x said their enemies are all the white people.So,he was racist?

If someone has suffered primarily at the hands of one people I can understand his anger towards them yes. I would not agree that all white people are bad or that they are devils, but to fail to understand where he was coming from in his early days demonstrates a grave immaturity on your behalf. As he grew and his experiences became more vaired his opinions changed as is demonstrated by the post above and numerous other quote like it. The fact that you and the american bigots commenting on this fail to see that says a lot more about you and what you would like malcolm to symbolise than it does about the actual man in question.

Secondly, if you had suffered all your life to date solely at the hands of black people, who ran the system you existed under, I'd be able to understand your bitterness. However, I would try to show you the truth.

But you haven't suffered any of this so yes your statement that 'black people are the enemy' would be entirely racist in my opinion, as I suspect (having read some of your recent posts, and your ducking of questions froma feamle contributor about your connection with golden dawn (or whoever they are)) are you.

Irish republicans are not racists, so why don't you and the racist americans that post here f*ck off somewhere else, like Combat 18 forums or something.

Comrade Ryan
12-20-2007, 03:42 PM
Yes but if someone came on here advocating traditional Catholicism as a means of solving societies problems I bet you would slate them.

I would indeed. But thats not what you have been talking about, your argument keeps evolving as you get slapped down. Its like trying to shoot a moving target.

I don't agree with a lot of what Malcolm said particularly in his earlier days, but religion was his salvation, perhaps he thought it could be others. Like a lot of religious people.

But I also believe that Malcolm had revolutionary tendancies which were increasing at the time of his murder.

They only 'reactionary' (for want of a better term) statements you have produced were ones before he left the Nation of Islam. I can only assume the reason you don't refer to any statements following this departure is because they are progressive and you choose not to view him that way and hope that others don't also. Your efforts are in vain.

Malcolm X was a walking contradiction, he dropped the racial separatism for sectarianism, stating he wanted Muslim only states in the US.

I am genuinely interested in this one. Can you direct me to where you got this info from as I haven't heard this before. And of course it goes without saying that this will be post-Nation of Islam.


So the question remains, what has this got to do with socialism ?.

I believe that through his writings, it is clear that Malcolm had a deep resepct for socialists and that he grew to appreciate the most important division in the world - the oppressed vs the oppressor. Indeed, he said that he believed that their would be a big clash in the world but when it came it wouldn't be based on race but on class.

And as for claiming Islam and Catholicism both discriminate against women, thats a lame answer and evades the fact Malcolm X was promoting the later.

Your point was that Islam discriminated against women, as if it was the only one that did. I merely pointed out that most world religions do, and thus it is not fair to single out one. Nor is it fair to single out one follower of a religion in an attempt to call his revolutionary credentials into question on the basis that his religion isn't steeped in equality. Would you have the same opinion of Padraic Pearse for example?

The fact he was also part White and some claim gay, shows what contradiction he actually was.

AFAIK his 'whiteness' is not something to brag about, seeing as it came from it being forced upon him and his relatives. The part gay thing? Really wise the f*ck up ya daft git.

Jerry_Corneilus
12-20-2007, 03:46 PM
Everybody is a walking contradiction comrade...


Some more then others.

Comrade Ryan
12-20-2007, 04:03 PM
Some more then others.

Any chance of dealing with my post Jerry?

greektzon
12-20-2007, 04:34 PM
[QUOTE=Comrade Ryan...... so why don't you and the racist americans that post here f*ck off somewhere else, like Combat 18 forums or something.
[/QUOTE]

Comrade Ryan as i saw the photo, Nazi Americans with Black people were together.
Greektzon wasn't there.
I am innocent...:eusa_shifty:

Emiliano Zapata
12-20-2007, 04:41 PM
Comrade Ryan as i saw the photo, Nazi Americans with Black people were together.
Greektzon wasn't there.
I am innocent...:eusa_shifty:

They are black seperatists and have some things in common with white nationalists, Malcolm X was a black seperatist at a point in his life, but seen the error of his ways.

Why cant people accept that malcolm changed his views, they always judge him by his early days and ignore his transformation after he split from the NOI.

Maverick
12-20-2007, 05:13 PM
This is a fine example of what being in the US Army does to you. It gives you the deluded view that all Muslims are terrorists. I feel sorry for you, I really do.

Yes I agree that my first reply was stereotyping all Muslims, Why? to show
a point! If you read most of the Commentary of all these posts, You will find
that, "In General, The "White Race" are being subjected to the same thing:
"STEREOTYPED" Meaning that the Whtie Devils, as This so called X stated in
many of his commentary while he was alive, and further, When a white person
defends themselves and retalliates with the same message, But, is fair to say
most Muslims Hate the white devil too! Now be honest and fair, To hold an
entire race guilty for what many white have done wrong in their past lives,
or in the present time is labeling all "White" must pay the price for that, The same, as I have now labled all Muslims guilty for what a lot of other Muslims
have done wrong and are Guilty of too!

Now just cause the Muslims and their faith is of Islam (The Koran) and it does teach those who believe, such as X later was converted unto, That any one
not of this faith and belief is what???? Meaning, What really are the White Race in comparison to the Arab Race that the Koran teaches? For years now
you see and hear, and not just by the USA Media, but other countries by
their own Media report that it is Muslim terrorist connected and or was Muslim
directly who commits these bombings and other against innocent lives in the
name of Allah! And Holler "Jihad" to boot! In America, We have many faiths
and beliefs not just Catholic and Christian! Do you hear or see any 1- person
in the name of Jesus straping a bomb to them selves to become a Martyr and
killing innocence? And spare me the answer, USA is doin it now in Iraq &
Afghanistan in the name of God with the Military!

X was no more than a loud spoken terrorist who used his cloak of secretcy by
not strapping a bomb to his person, but his words in general was to provoke
the blacks in to coming against the whites, either by "Rioting and by any Means nesessary to over throw the Govt of the United States! X was not only
doing his bidding, but, doing the Muslim's bidding as well!

Now then, If all of the Muslims believe what they say are a few fanatics and
radicals in the name of Islam doing these wrongs of beheading and killing of
innocent children and etc., then why do not they clean their own house?, In
stead of the USA cleaning it for them!

And by the way, all those liars who would make the world believe, That this
war against Iraq was for their "OIL", What Oil are they talking about "Olive Oil
for cooking and salads? Have not you heard that the cost for Oil from that
region as trippled it's self, The prices at USA's pumps for the average American, is ridiculos, To my understanding, Iraq Govt is supposed to pay back America for their help in removing a 'Dictator" who not only Killed his
own people of the Muslim Faith, but your brethren of Iran as well! Most will
applaud Sadam Husein & Osama Bin Laden and Curse the USA! In closing, Maybe the US needs to change their Tactics and Strategy and do what Husein & Laden has done over the years to get respect!

And where were all these so called Xs of the Muslim faith and the Muslims themselves, when poverished countries and starving children needed clothes,
food, water & shelter, and "Genoside" going on with their so called love for the Black Man? I will tell you, sitting in their Palaces and homes watching it
happen on their Satelite TVs sitting on their butts as usuall, and Complaining,
Why has'nt the US done something by now????? Why? The USA was always the first to rush in at any cry for help, but under that ridiculos " Clinton Admin"
cost America lives for trying to help in Somolia! What we got for aiding the
local folk and fighting their ruthless Warlord Chieftain, was our soldiers dead
bodies draged through the streets while 'Dancing and Cheering" to boot! Was that
their way of saying "Thank you America?" So you need not feel sorry for me or
give me a lecture in common compassion for another! And as for X, what can I say, He was NO Martyr in that being true in the hearts and minds of the Majority of America, Only a Fanatic & Radical wanting to cause trouble not
seek a solution to the problem!

Maverick
12-20-2007, 05:24 PM
This is a fine example of what being in the US Army does to you. It gives you the deluded view that all Muslims are terrorists. I feel sorry for you, I really do.

Yes I agree that my first reply was stereotyping all Muslims, Why? to show
a point! If you read most of the Commentary of all these posts, You will find
that, "In General, The "White Race" are being subjected to the same thing:
"STEREOTYPED" Meaning that the Whtie Devils, as This so called X stated in
many of his commentary while he was alive, and further, When a white person
defends themselves and retalliates with the same message, But, is fair to say
most Muslims Hate the white devil too! Now be honest and fair, To hold an
entire race guilty for what many white have done wrong in their past lives,
or in the present time is labeling all "White" must pay the price for that, The same, as I hace now labled all Muslims guilty for what a lot of other Muslims
have done wrong and are Guilty of too!

Now just cause the Muslims and their faith is of Islam (The Koran) and it does teach those who believe, such as X later was converted unto, That any one
not of this faith and belief is what???? Meaning, What really are the White Race in comparison to the Arab Race that the Koran teaches? For years now
you see and hear, and not just by the USA Media, but other countries by
their own Media report that it is Muslim terrorist connected and or was Muslim
directly who commits these bombings and other against innocent lives in the
name of Allah! And Holler "Jihad" to boot! In America, We have many faiths
and beliefs not just Catholic and Christian! Do you hear or see any 1- person
in the name of Jesus straping a bomb to them selves to become a Martyr and
killing innocence? And spare me the answer, USA is doin it now in Iraq &
Afghanistan in the name of God with the Military!

X was no more than a loud spoken terrorist who used his cloak of secretcy by
not strapping a bomb to his person, but his words in general was to provoke
the blacks in to coming against the whites, either by "Rioting and by any Means nesessary to over throw the Govt of the United States! X was not only
doing his bidding, but, doing the Muslim's bidding as well!

Now then, If all of the Muslims believe what they say are a few fanatics and
radicals in the name of Islam doing these wrongs of beheading and killing of
innocent children and etc., then why do not they clean their own house?, In
stead of the USA cleaning it for them!

And by the way, all those liars who would make the worls believe, That this
war against Iraq was for their "OIL", What Oil are they talking about "Olive Oil
for cooking and salads? Have not you heard that the cost for Oil from that
region as trippled it's self, The prices at USA's pumps for the average American, is ridiculos, To my understanding, Iraq Govt is supposed to pay back America for their help in removing a 'Dictator" who not only Killed his
own people of the Muslim Faith, but your brethren of Iran as well! Most will
applaud Sadam Husein & Osama Bin Laden and Curse the USA! In closing, Maybe the US needs to change their Tactics and Strategy and do what Husein & Laden has done over the years to get respect!

And where were all these so called Xs of the Muslim faith and the Muslims themselves, when poverished countries and starving children needed clothes,
food, water & shelter, and "Genoside" going on with their so called love for the Black Man? I will tell you, stting in their Palaces and homes watching it
happen on their Satelite TVs sitting on their butts as usuall, and Complaining,
Why has'nt the US done something by now????? Why? The USA was always the first to rush in at any cry for help, but under that ridiculos " Clinton Admin"
cost America lives for trying to help in Somolia! What we got for aiding the
local folk and fighting their ruthless Warlord Chieftain, was our soldiers dead
bodies through the streets while 'Dancing and Cheering" to boot! Was that
their way of saying "Thank you America?" So you need not feel sorry for me or
give me a lecture in common compassion for another! And as for X, what can I say, He was NO Martyr in that being true in the hearts and minds of the Majority of America, Only a Fanatic & Radical wanting to cause trouble not
seek a solution to the problem!

liam
12-20-2007, 05:25 PM
If someone has suffered primarily at the hands of one people I can understand his anger towards them yes. I would not agree that all white people are bad or that they are devils, but to fail to understand where he was coming from in his early days demonstrates a grave immaturity on your behalf. As he grew and his experiences became more vaired his opinions changed as is demonstrated by the post above and numerous other quote like it. The fact that you and the american bigots commenting on this fail to see that says a lot more about you and what you would like malcolm to symbolise than it does about the actual man in question.

Secondly, if you had suffered all your life to date solely at the hands of black people, who ran the system you existed under, I'd be able to understand your bitterness. However, I would try to show you the truth.

But you haven't suffered any of this so yes your statement that 'black people are the enemy' would be entirely racist in my opinion, as I suspect (having read some of your recent posts, and your ducking of questions froma feamle contributor about your connection with golden dawn (or whoever they are)) are you.

Irish republicans are not racists, so why don't you and the racist americans that post here f*ck off somewhere else, like Combat 18 forums or something.

:eusa_clap:

Jerry_Corneilus
12-20-2007, 05:41 PM
I would indeed. But thats not what you have been talking about, your argument keeps evolving as you get slapped down. Its like trying to shoot a moving target.

I don't agree with a lot of what Malcolm said particularly in his earlier days, but religion was his salvation, perhaps he thought it could be others. Like a lot of religious people.

But I also believe that Malcolm had revolutionary tendancies which were increasing at the time of his murder.

They only 'reactionary' (for want of a better term) statements you have produced were ones before he left the Nation of Islam. I can only assume the reason you don't refer to any statements following this departure is because they are progressive and you choose not to view him that way and hope that others don't also. Your efforts are in vain.



I am genuinely interested in this one. Can you direct me to where you got this info from as I haven't heard this before. And of course it goes without saying that this will be post-Nation of Islam.




I believe that through his writings, it is clear that Malcolm had a deep resepct for socialists and that he grew to appreciate the most important division in the world - the oppressed vs the oppressor. Indeed, he said that he believed that their would be a big clash in the world but when it came it wouldn't be based on race but on class.



Your point was that Islam discriminated against women, as if it was the only one that did. I merely pointed out that most world religions do, and thus it is not fair to single out one. Nor is it fair to single out one follower of a religion in an attempt to call his revolutionary credentials into question on the basis that his religion isn't steeped in equality. Would you have the same opinion of Padraic Pearse for example?



AFAIK his 'whiteness' is not something to brag about, seeing as it came from it being forced upon him and his relatives. The part gay thing? Really wise the f*ck up ya daft git.



Revolutionary tenedencies don't mean anything, Pol Pot was a revolutionary as are the Taliban.

If you read what he wrote about his trip to Mecca at the end of his life, he wrote that he related to people in terms of whether they were Muslim, not in terms of class.

A big clash between whom ? The capitalists on one side v the Muslims, gays,blacks, socialists, on the other, simplistic nonsense, are many Muslims not capitalists,(as are many blacks) ?

Which you term the oppressor v the oppressed, wonder what side gays in Iraq will take ?

If someone is preaching a world view based on sectarianism then it is ok to criticise them,the same goes for Padraic Pearse,

And attempting to claim all regions equally oppress women is just pc nonsense.

I don't see any women getting stoned to death in Dublin by the church do you ?

Maverick
12-20-2007, 06:02 PM
Revolutionary tenedencies don't mean anything, Pol Pot was a revolutionary as are the Taliban.

And attempting to claim all regions equally oppress women is just pc nonsense.

I don't see any women getting stoned to death in Dublin by the church do you ?

Well said and to the point!

greektzon
12-20-2007, 06:20 PM
They are black seperatists and have some things in common with white nationalists, Malcolm X was a black seperatist at a point in his life, but seen the error of his ways.

Why cant people accept that malcolm changed his views, they always judge him by his early days and ignore his transformation after he split from the NOI.

Good question Republican _Sosialist.
Maybe for the same reason who some members from this forum judge me and they call me nazi...:hmmm:

Emiliano Zapata
12-20-2007, 06:40 PM
Good question Republican _Sosialist.
Maybe for the same reason who some members from this forum judge me and they call me nazi...:hmmm:

If you are not a neo-nazi why dont you change your preferred party from golden dawn to something else, and try and refrain from slandering jews.

mickyk200
12-20-2007, 06:45 PM
If you are not a neo-nazi why dont you change your preferred party from golden dawn to something else, and try and refrain from slandering jews.
yey jews for the win!
I hate to admit it but I had somewhat of a white nationalist sympathy in my teenage years. I read Mein Kampf which coverted me to socialism and eventually republicanism.

Emiliano Zapata
12-20-2007, 06:48 PM
yey jews for the win!
I hate to admit it but I had somewhat of a white nationalist sympathy in my teenage years. I read Mein Kampf which coverted me to socialism and eventually republicanism.

When did you stray away from socialism and become a follower of sinn fein:)

mickyk200
12-20-2007, 06:53 PM
When did you stray away from socialism and become a follower of sinn fein:)
Previously my preferred party was Sinn Fein and IRSP ..it came under some critism so I changed it.
I think it would be an easier target to acheive a 32 county state with a petty bougoise system and then introduce a socialist state rather than hit two birds with one stone.

Emiliano Zapata
12-20-2007, 06:55 PM
Previously my preferred party was Sinn Fein and IRSP ..it came under some critism so I changed it.
I think it would be an easier target to acheive a 32 county state with a petty bougoise system and then introduce a socialist state rather than hit two birds with one stone.

Is that what sinn fein believes too?

mickyk200
12-20-2007, 07:00 PM
Is that what sinn fein believes too?
I doubt it...
going with the side I think are most likly to gain a UI.
My own personal belief ,feel free to poke holes in it..I really dont care

Emiliano Zapata
12-20-2007, 07:19 PM
I doubt it...
going with the side I think are most likly to gain a UI.
My own personal belief ,feel free to poke holes in it..I really dont care

So do you feel national liberation is more important than a socialist revolution?

mickyk200
12-20-2007, 07:23 PM
So do you feel national liberation is more important than a socialist revolution?
yes...100%
I would prefer a 32 county social democratic republic then work towards socialism in a self-determined state; than struggle for another 800 years against Britian for a 32 county socialist republic

ciaranxavier
12-20-2007, 09:10 PM
I would like to ask you something ciaranxavier.If i will tell (example,ok?)the black people are enemies,am i racist?

yes because the black people as an entire race shouldnt be an enemy if theres a dispute with a country that is not racist but to say an entire race is your enemy is racist.

ciaranxavier
12-20-2007, 09:11 PM
Because i read Malcolm x said their enemies are all the white people.So,he was racist?

he came to a differant conclusion when he was older and denounced his previous thoughts.

ANE32
12-21-2007, 01:59 AM
Must get my hands on that book! I have copies of most of his speeches.What I like about Malcom X is he was not prepared to beg for the freedom of the black people,He demanded it! A footnote,I also admire Dr Martin Luther King Jr and have met and spoken to one of his daughters.

Comrade Ryan
12-21-2007, 03:12 PM
Yes I agree that my first reply was stereotyping all Muslims, Why? to show
a point! If you read most of the Commentary of all these posts, You will find
that, "In General, The "White Race" are being subjected to the same thing:
"STEREOTYPED" Meaning that the Whtie Devils, as This so called X stated in
many of his commentary while he was alive, and further, When a white person
defends themselves and retalliates with the same message, But, is fair to say
most Muslims Hate the white devil too! Now be honest and fair, To hold an
entire race guilty for what many white have done wrong in their past lives,
or in the present time is labeling all "White" must pay the price for that, The same, as I hace now labled all Muslims guilty for what a lot of other Muslims
have done wrong and are Guilty of too!

Now just cause the Muslims and their faith is of Islam (The Koran) and it does teach those who believe, such as X later was converted unto, That any one
not of this faith and belief is what???? Meaning, What really are the White Race in comparison to the Arab Race that the Koran teaches? For years now
you see and hear, and not just by the USA Media, but other countries by
their own Media report that it is Muslim terrorist connected and or was Muslim
directly who commits these bombings and other against innocent lives in the
name of Allah! And Holler "Jihad" to boot! In America, We have many faiths
and beliefs not just Catholic and Christian! Do you hear or see any 1- person
in the name of Jesus straping a bomb to them selves to become a Martyr and
killing innocence? And spare me the answer, USA is doin it now in Iraq &
Afghanistan in the name of God with the Military!

X was no more than a loud spoken terrorist who used his cloak of secretcy by
not strapping a bomb to his person, but his words in general was to provoke
the blacks in to coming against the whites, either by "Rioting and by any Means nesessary to over throw the Govt of the United States! X was not only
doing his bidding, but, doing the Muslim's bidding as well!

Now then, If all of the Muslims believe what they say are a few fanatics and
radicals in the name of Islam doing these wrongs of beheading and killing of
innocent children and etc., th