Future of RIRA

[duggie-89]

what is the future of the RIRA? i am just wondering how do people view the next steps for the RIRA??

will they start up a renewed armed struggle??

will they collapse to feuds??

will they take a less military approach??

[East Tyrone]

I'd like to see them and the contos stand down, decommission and enter the political process. I know that about 99% of the Irish people feel the same way.

[robertemmett]

I'd like to see them and the contos stand down, decommission and enter the political process. I know that about 99% of the Irish people feel the same way.

ah, he knows what 99% of the people want. that sounds very DeValerian, did you just look into your heart?

could you look into your heart and tell me what percentage of the Irish people supported Pearse and boys in 1916?

[ardonian]

Here goes our very own statistics expert E.T.And also what a stupid question.

[East Tyrone]

ah, he knows what 99% of the people want. that sounds very DeValerian, did you just look into your heart?

could you look into your heart and tell me what percentage of the Irish people supported Pearse and boys in 1916?
You're not seriously trying to compare the RIRA to Pádraig Pearse are you?

Here goes our very own statistics expert E.T.And also what a stupid question.
How is it a stupid question?

[Jim]

Is it not a bit of a coincedence that the two people who were supporting the wild claims made in the irish news in another thread rushed to create a meaningless poll about the rira?

Why didnt you create this poll yesterday or last week duggie?

[duggie-89]

because i want to see people opinions on the RIRA and the directions it needs to take if they want to suceed.

this poll is not about bashing RIRA its trying to create discussion on what the RIRA should do.

now i didn't say i supported the claims i said i wouldn't be suprised and i gave my opinion on the matter. i also outline in my opinion the problems facing the RIRA.

now if you cant discuss this without complaining then so be it but let the tread develop for people who do want to talk about the RIRA.

[Jim]

because i want to see people opinions on the RIRA and the directions it needs to take if they want to suceed.

this poll is not about bashing RIRA its trying to create discussion on what the RIRA should do.

now i didn't say i supported the claims i said i wouldn't be suprised and i gave my opinion on the matter. i also outline in my opinion the problems facing the RIRA.

now if you cant discuss this without complaining then so be it but let the tread develop for people who do want to talk about the RIRA.

Im not complaining because i wouldnt give you the opportuinity to feign indignation but are you seriously suggesting that you just decided to put out the poll today for no reason.

If someone put up a poll about the provos in the aftermath of the northern bank,robert mccartney or anything else then you'd be in the same position.

Why is the poll in the 32CSM forum anyway?

[duggie-89]

Im not complaining because i wouldnt give you the opportuinity to feign indignation but are you seriously suggesting that you just decided to put out the poll today for no reason.

If someone put up a poll about the provos in the aftermath of the northern bank,robert mccartney or anything else then you'd be in the same position.

Why is the poll in the 32CSM forum anyway?

firstly no i am not sugesting that, the whole reason has been because of the article in the irish news brought the RIRA to my attention again and i was wondering about peoples opinions on the matter.

well i would welcome them to put one forward as its opening up discussion which is what i am doing here.

well it is for a few reasons because the RIRA have been linked to the 32csm and in fact a poll on this fourm shows that alot of users believe the 32csm should publicy support the RIRA so to me that shows that there is interest for the RIRA on this fourm.

[Hessian Peel]

I think the Real IRA should call a ceasefire or just remain inactive as regards offensive actions.

[ardonian]

"REMAIN inactive"?

[Hessian Peel]

Perhaps I didn't phrase that particularly well.

I simply meant that they should cease all offensive operations.

[duggie-89]

I think the Real IRA should call a ceasefire or just remain inactive as regards offensive actions.

well do you want me to add another option of a no first strike policy like the INLA??

[Hessian Peel]

I don't really give a toss to be brutally honest. The whole thread is a bit silly.

[Jim]

firstly no i am not sugesting that, the whole reason has been because of the article in the irish news brought the RIRA to my attention again

I find it hard to believe that anyone opposed to armed actions as the majority of your posts suggests would need a article to remind them of the RIRA.
Like how could you forget about someone or something you oppose ffs.You clearly saw an opportuinity to stick it to the RIRA for your own political ends and the rashness of your initial response wont do your integrity any favours.

well i would welcome them to put one forward as its opening up discussion which is what i am doing here.


If you were opening up discussion you'd have put it in the main discussion forum instead of our forum, but getting back to your point for a moment.
I dont believe any provo would welcome a poll about the PIRA on the basis of a false article written by anyone.

well it is for a few reasons because the RIRA have been linked to the 32csm and in fact a poll on this fourm shows that alot of users believe the 32csm should publicy support the RIRA so to me that shows that there is interest for the RIRA on this fourm.

There is no organsational link between the 32CSM and the RIRA,that is a fact.We are two separate organisations.

We have no influence on their policies and vice versa.If we were the political wing of the RIRA why would we bother providing policy documents,having debate,democratic structures,advocating co-operation with other groups on certain issues as outlined in the republican unity project?

This motion was passed unamiously by all the representatives of our cumainns and committees at our agm recently.

14.That this AGM recognise the right of the Irish People to National Sovereignty and National Self Determination and that we also recognise the right of Óglaigh na hÉireann to bear arms in defence of that right.


Personally speaking i dont really know how much more public support we can give to be honest.
The vast majority of the members in 32CSM would support the RIRA,some may not support armed struggle but we are a democratic organisation and the comfortable and completely democratic processes within the movement allow for people to hold different views on armed struggle without neglecting our policies.

To be honest i dont care what members of the forum who arent members of our movement think we should do as its our members who decide and i havent seen anything that suggests anything less than what was voted on in the agm.

[RSF-Fianoglach]

EAST tyrone,i bet you would love to see the CIRA stand down and roll over for the brits,accept british rule,endorse british police in ireland,but then that would be a very anti republican thing to do and not something you expect any irish republican army to do
and would mean all the patriots who have gone before died in vain,because they certainly didnt die for eqaul rights alone.

[East Tyrone]

EAST tyrone,i bet you would love to see the CIRA stand down and roll over for the brits,accept british rule,endorse british police in ireland,but then that would be a very anti republican thing to do and not something you expect any irish republican army to do
and would mean all the patriots who have gone before died in vain,because they certainly didnt die for eqaul rights alone.

Yeah Tomas, they should send all their spades to your mates in the Leb.

[Cael]

I'd like to see them and the contos stand down, decommission and enter the political process. I know that about 99% of the Irish people feel the same way.


The Political Process???

No doubt you mean the British Crown Political Process.

No thanks Uncle ET.

[East Tyrone]

The Political Process???

No doubt you mean the British Crown Political Process.

No thanks Uncle ET.

Cael, if you were my nephew there would have been a bit of sense knocked into you years ago.

[Cael]

Yeah Tomas, they should send all their spades to your mates in the Leb.


Have you ever seen Politics.ie?


There is a poster on there called Factual. He pretends to be a PSF member, but all his posts just shame and disgrace PSF even more than they normally shame and disgrace themselves. I imagine, ET, that you have been ordered to fulfill the same function on this site.

[East Tyrone]

Have you ever seen Politics.ie?


There is a poster on there called Factual. He pretends to be a PSF member, but all his posts just shame and disgrace PSF even more than they normally shame and disgrace themselves. I imagine, ET, that you have been ordered to fulfill the same function on this site.

Ordered by whom Cael? If you are going to make an allegation you might as well have the courage to come out with it. We can duel in the Arena; spades at 50 paces.

[Cael]

Ordered by whom Cael? If you are going to make an allegation you might as well have the courage to come out with it. We can duel in the Arena; spades at 50 paces.

I would have thought that obvious. You are just an MI5 sockpuppet if I ever saw one.

[Seabird]

Cael,

And I know a guy named Cael that posted on p.ie, he was banned for his stupid posts. I even recall many laughing at him and finally ignoring him because his post were so full of sh*te. Would you happen to know him?:hmmm:

[East Tyrone]

Cael, I'm not going to be baited by your childish allegations; particularly coming from a parody character like yourself.

[Cael]

Cael,

And I know a guy named Cael that posted on p.ie, he was banned for his stupid posts. I even recall many laughing at him and finally ignoring him because his post were so full of sh*te. Would you happen to know him?:hmmm:


You are entitled to your opinion about the standard of my posts, Seabird. I cannot say anything about the standard of your posts, a chara, as this is the first one I have taken the trouble to read.

[Seabird]

ET,

You are correct, he acted the same way on p.ie, that is why I do not respond to his posts, shame on me for answering this time.

[Cael]

Cael, I'm not going to be baited by your childish allegations; particularly coming from a parody character like yourself.

I think most Republicans on this site share my opinion, a chara.

[FIM-92]

I think everyone is getting pretty sick of your petty arguements, that goes for all of you. If you have problems with eachother, you can take it to the arena, or take it clean off this forum, because we're not going to let it descend into a kip again.
Back on topic please.

[Seabird]

Admin,

Oops, sorry:(

[southarmaghceltic1888]

I dont think the RIRA has any real capacity to carry on a real campaign. I think they should right now get involved more in politics, start to reorganize, recruit, and possibly try to rearm. When the time comes they will be ready.

[East Tyrone]

I dont think the RIRA has any real capacity to carry on a real campaign. I think they should right now get involved more in politics, start to reorganize, recruit, and possibly try to rearm. When the time comes they will be ready.
That's fanciful stuff, there will be no right time to be ready for. There is nothing positive that can be achieved through violence.

[eghzarw]

I dont think the RIRA has any real capacity to carry on a real campaign. I think they should right now get involved more in politics, start to reorganize, recruit, and possibly try to rearm. When the time comes they will be ready.

I think I have just recently read that they are currently reorganizing and recruiting, hence the increased activity.

[Carlos McJackle]

i doubt theyl be announcing it on an internet forum . therefore death to this idiotic thread and a bag of poo on the head of the eejit who started it

[East Tyrone]

I think I have just recently read that they are currently reorganizing and recruiting, hence the increased activity.

"Reorganising"? Were they ever organised in the first place? They need to be disbanded and disarmed, plain and simple.

[decko murray]

"Reorganising"? Were they ever organised in the first place? They need to be disbanded and disarmed, plain and simple.

YOU SAY disbanded and disarmed but who is going to take the fight to the BRITS.WHAT about the BIG british spy complex in HOLYWOOD,WHAT that their for.DO you really what the REALS to disarm,who going to protect us from the loyalists as well because the CROWD you support have sold us out for a bit of POWER and MONEY...

[duggie-89]

i doubt theyl be announcing it on an internet forum . therefore death to this idiotic thread and a bag of poo on the head of the eejit who started it

incase you dont realise the whole concept of this fourm. its were republican people come on and discuss what THEIR views are. i am not expecting the rira to come on this site and announce their intentions and give a detailed plan of actions.

what i am asking is for your opinion on what course the rira should take.

[ciaranxavier]

the english troops....targets.
the english government......targets
the english economics......targets

this is where i believe a renewed campaign should go. and by english i mean the ones in the 6.

[duggie-89]

I find it hard to believe that anyone opposed to armed actions as the majority of your posts suggests would need a article to remind them of the RIRA.
Like how could you forget about someone or something you oppose ffs.You clearly saw an opportuinity to stick it to the RIRA for your own political ends and the rashness of your initial response wont do your integrity any favours..


well its not like i forgot all about the rira like i had a memory loss. the reason i brought this up was because the actions and role of the rira was in general being discussed and so i took the chance to find out what peoples opinions on the future direct the rira should take. there was nothing sinster behind it and if that is the way it comes across i appoligise.

If you were opening up discussion you'd have put it in the main discussion forum instead of our forum, but getting back to your point for a moment.
I dont believe any provo would welcome a poll about the PIRA on the basis of a false article written by anyone..

just because someone doesn't welcome a topic doesn't mean we should avoid asking the question. should we avoid asking the brits about its dirty war because they would not welcome us doing so???

but i wanted to get the opinion of mostly 32csm members. and i think that was evident as i tried to included various other options for armed struggle and it wasn't a simply start another war or disband poll.



There is no organsational link between the 32CSM and the RIRA,that is a fact.We are two separate organisations.

We have no influence on their policies and vice versa.If we were the political wing of the RIRA why would we bother providing policy documents,having debate,democratic structures,advocating co-operation with other groups on certain issues as outlined in the republican unity project?

i am not asking for the feedback from the RIRA i am asking for feedback from the fourm members whom alot i have respect for. i just think this is the best time to raise the question and in this sub fourm because out of all the sub fourms and party fourms the 32csm would be seen to be more for the rira than any other.

Personally speaking i dont really know how much more public support we can give to be honest.
The vast majority of the members in 32CSM would support the RIRA,some may not support armed struggle but we are a democratic organisation and the comfortable and completely democratic processes within the movement allow for people to hold different views on armed struggle without neglecting our policies.


ok fair enough why could you not have simply said that at the start and givin your opinion because this is what i am wanting to find out. what direction in their armed struggle would you like them to take??

and if your so comfortable with people holding different views why did you start to bring the image of the poll into disrupte by claiming that it was mud slinging of such. if what you say above is true then we have the same idea and view lets hear what people have to say.

[duggie-89]

the english troops....targets.
the english government......targets
the english economics......targets

this is where i believe a renewed campaign should go. and by english i mean the ones in the 6.

so do you believe in bombing comerical targerts in the north??? and by government you mean stormont????

[ciaranxavier]

so do you believe in bombing comerical targerts in the north??? and by government you mean stormont????

it was pretty straightforward. and i theres more economics then commercial targets. and by commercial targets i think you mean business districts with lots of civilian and thats what i refer to when i say theres more economics then commercial targets.

[duggie-89]

it was pretty straightforward. and i theres more economics then commercial targets.

well can i have a few examples because usually (well for me) when people say economics is usually means commerical.

so you would bomb and oppose the set up of a local devolved government with irish people having the powers.

and yes ok it may be limited but at the end of the day there has to be some kind of devolution of powers within uk or UI. otherwise what its more of a choice between dublin rule or london rule???

[ciaranxavier]

well can i have a few examples because usually (well for me) when people say economics is usually means commerical.

so you would bomb and oppose the set up of a local devolved government with irish people having the powers.

and yes ok it may be limited but at the end of the day there has to be some kind of devolution of powers within uk or UI. otherwise what its more of a choice between dublin rule or london rule???

well can i have a few examples because usually (well for me) when people say economics is usually means commerical.

freight trains, freighters, freight trucks. there is a lot of targets that would suffice with a low chance of extra casualties.

so you would bomb and oppose the set up of a local devolved government with irish people having the powers.

i dont support and irish killing the irish but you dont have to bomb the whole parliamant building paisleys car would do.

[Rory O'Connor]

You're not seriously trying to compare the RIRA to Pádraig Pearse are you?


How is it a stupid question?

Why shouldn't he respect Óglaigh na hÉireann as much as he respects Pádraig Pearse?

[duggie-89]

well can i have a few examples because usually (well for me) when people say economics is usually means commerical.

freight trains, freighters, freight trucks. there is a lot of targets that would suffice with a low chance of extra casualties.

so you would bomb and oppose the set up of a local devolved government with irish people having the powers.

i dont support and irish killing the irish but you dont have to bomb the whole parliamant building paisleys car would do.

ah rite thanks comrade for clearing that up for me.

[ciaranxavier]

ah rite thanks comrade for clearing that up for me.

lol no problem do you agree or disagree?

[Jim]

well its not like i forgot all about the rira like i had a memory loss.

Seems that way.

the reason i brought this up was because the actions and role of the rira was in general being discussed

No they werent being discussed,you brought up the article published in the irish news and within a couple of hours (if that) brought up this poll.

If there was a discussion on the RIRA itself maybe you'd have a point but there wasnt.The fact that the two people who were initially very eager to suggest this article was true also being the same two to bring up a poll and demonise the RIRA doesnt help your explanation either to be honest.

so i took the chance to find out what peoples opinions on the future direct the rira should take. there was nothing sinster behind it and if that is the way it comes across i appoligise.


Well if i was being impolite i also apologise but i still believe that the poll was made basically to stick it to the RIRA.

Surely you'd accept that if someone was initially taken in by these wild accusations that they might vote for the RIRA to disband and would you also accept my point of view that it would be highly probable that someone from a provo view would knowingly seek to capitalise on such a situation to suggest that the RIRA had no support?

just because someone doesn't welcome a topic doesn't mean we should avoid asking the question. should we avoid asking the brits about its dirty war because they would not welcome us doing so???

but i wanted to get the opinion of mostly 32csm members. and i think that was evident as i tried to included various other options for armed struggle and it wasn't a simply start another war or disband poll.


Well as i said before the motion passed at our agm should put you in no doubt duggie and that is all that needs to be said.

ok fair enough why could you not have simply said that at the start and givin your opinion because this is what i am wanting to find out. what direction in their armed struggle would you like them to take??


What ive given is fact and it doesnt need a poll to make it anymore of a fact,especially as it was a politically loaded poll on the back of unfounded allegations of the army.

The 32CSM have nothing to do with the procedures of a military organisation and is best left to people who do.
No member of the 32CSM would attempt to dictate military strategy to the army because members of the army would tell them to **** off and would be correct in doing so.

and if your so comfortable with people holding different views why did you start to bring the image of the poll into disrupte by claiming that it was mud slinging of such. if what you say above is true then we have the same idea and view lets hear what people have to say.

Your twisting what i said duggie and you should re read what i said looking closely at the fact i was referring to our movement.
Does any other organisation have internal discussions on public websites or does it have to be us?

And as i said....
To be honest i dont care what members of the forum who arent members of our movement think we should do as its our members who decide and i havent seen anything that suggests anything less than what was voted on in the agm.

[East Tyrone]

YOU SAY disbanded and disarmed but who is going to take the fight to the BRITS.WHAT about the BIG british spy complex in HOLYWOOD,WHAT that their for.DO you really what the REALS to disarm,who going to protect us from the loyalists as well because the CROWD you support have sold us out for a bit of POWER and MONEY...

I haven't noticed them take "the fight to the Brits" in the last 10 years and they're hardly going to start now; sorry to burst your bubble. What about the big spy complex indeed, that's the command centre for a significant portion of the RIRA's personnel and it's not like the rest of them are going to do anything about it. How do you suggest the RIRA will "protect us from the loyalists"? Maybe from forging closer links like the've been doing lately?

[ciaranxavier]

I haven't noticed them take "the fight to the Brits" in the last 10 years and they're hardly going to start now; sorry to burst your bubble. What about the big spy complex indeed, that's the command centre for a significant portion of the RIRA's personnel and it's not like the rest of them are going to do anything about it. How do you suggest the RIRA will "protect us from the loyalists"? Maybe from forging closer links like the've been doing lately?

could you elaborate on your accusations of the RIRA working with british intelligence and loyalists.

[East Tyrone]

could you elaborate on your accusations of the RIRA working with british intelligence and loyalists.

It has been proven that former senior members of the RIRA have been Brit intel agents; these include people involved in the Omagh bombing and in setting people up for jail sentences. There are already a number of threads concerning allegations of links with Loyalists.

[ciaranxavier]

It has been proven that former senior members of the RIRA have been Brit intel agents; these include people involved in the Omagh bombing and in setting people up for jail sentences. There are already a number of threads concerning allegations of links with Loyalists.

so can be said with the PIRA they had their fair share of informers as well. and when fighting one of the worlds highest advanced intelligence agencys it shouldnt be a surprise that theyre able to plant their own men inside the republicans armed movements.

[East Tyrone]

so can be said with the PIRA they had their fair share of informers as well. and when fighting one of the worlds highest advanced intelligence agencys it shouldnt be a surprise that theyre able to plant their own men inside the republicans armed movements.

The differance being that the PIRA no longer maintain weapons that can be misdirected to produce civilian casualties or used to set people up for jail sentences.

[ciaranxavier]

The differance being that the PIRA no longer maintain weapons that can be misdirected to produce civilian casualties or used to set people up for jail sentences.

man thats a dumb theory, it was alright when you guys were doing it but now that your not it is wrong and makes you differant and better then the rest. so in essence other then the fact that the PIRA went back on their promise to defend and reunite ireland there is not differance between the two?

[East Tyrone]

man thats a dumb theory, it was alright when you guys were doing it but now that your not it is wrong and makes you differant and better then the rest. so in essence other then the fact that the PIRA went back on their promise to defend and reunite ireland there is not differance between the two?

No offense Ciaran, but that is a very simplistic outlook. The IRA were engaged in a 30+ year campaign which proved that armed action would not secure reunification, indeed it proved counter-productive to unification. All that violence can ever achieve, in any likely scenario, in Ireland is death, division, suffering and tragedy. The RIRA don't even have the excuse of the pretense at a viable campaign to justify their existance. Their only reason to exist is to line the pockets of a select few, while the duped go to jail. They provide Britain with a vehicle to influence the dirty peace, now that the war is over.

[ciaranxavier]

No offense Ciaran, but that is a very simplistic outlook. The IRA were engaged in a 30+ year campaign which proved that armed action would not secure reunification, indeed it proved counter-productive to unification. All that violence can ever achieve, in any likely scenario, in Ireland is death, division, suffering and tragedy. The RIRA don't even have the excuse of the pretense at a viable campaign to justify their existance. Their only reason to exist is to line the pockets of a select few, while the duped go to jail. They provide Britain with a vehicle to influence the dirty peace, now that the war is over.

he IRA were engaged in a 30+ year campaign which proved that armed action would not secure reunification,

how were the 26 achieved?

indeed it proved counter-productive to unification.

how so?

The RIRA don't even have the excuse of the pretense at a viable campaign to justify their existance. Their only reason to exist is to line the pockets of a select few, while the duped go to jail.

i highly doubt this and the only ones seemingly concerned with lining their pockets IMO are the ones in bed with britain and taking money from her "majestys" coffers to run a sham gov.

They provide Britain with a vehicle to influence the dirty peace, now that the war is over.

the war isnt over as the 6 are still occupied. unless you could give me a reason that the war has ended?

[East Tyrone]

he IRA were engaged in a 30+ year campaign which proved that armed action would not secure reunification,

how were the 26 achieved?

Totally differant strategic and socio-political landscape; the comparison is invalid I'm afraid. If it wasn't the last campaign would have been successful.

indeed it proved counter-productive to unification.

how so?
By increasing division between north and south for one thing. Two or three generations in the south were raised in an environment of state and media-sponsored antagonism towards Republicans and northerners. The prolongued nature of the campaign also stifled efforts to build national consensus and political progress.

The RIRA don't even have the excuse of the pretense at a viable campaign to justify their existance. Their only reason to exist is to line the pockets of a select few, while the duped go to jail.
i highly doubt this and the only ones seemingly concerned with lining their pockets IMO are the ones in bed with britain and taking money from her "majestys" coffers to run a sham gov.
People need civic administrations no matter what spin you want to put on it.



They provide Britain with a vehicle to influence the dirty peace, now that the war is over.

the war isnt over as the 6 are still occupied. unless you could give me a reason that the war has ended?
The IRA's war is over and the place is almost totally demilitarised; I don't see much evidence of any supposed war going on.

[ciaranxavier]

Totally differant strategic and socio-political landscape; the comparison is invalid I'm afraid. If it wasn't the last campaign would have been successful.

By increasing division between north and south for one thing. Two or three generations in the south were raised in an environment of state and media-sponsored antagonism towards Republicans and northerners. The prolongued nature of the campaign also stifled efforts to build national consensus and political progress.

People need civic administrations no matter what spin you want to put on it.


The IRA's war is over and the place is almost totally demilitarised; I don't see much evidence of any supposed war going on.

Totally differant strategic and socio-political landscape; the comparison is invalid I'm afraid. If it wasn't the last campaign would have been successful.

the underlying causes are the same though.

By increasing division between north and south for one thing. Two or three generations in the south were raised in an environment of state and media-sponsored antagonism towards Republicans and northerners. The prolongued nature of the campaign also stifled efforts to build national consensus and political progress.

then thats the states fault not the IRA's. and the thing that stifled political progress was the fact that until you guys agreed to no one was willing to sully their reputation for a paid ride courtesy of her majestys puppet gov.


People need civic administrations no matter what spin you want to put on it.

true but one ran by ireland in all countys not a foreign power.



The IRA's war is over and the place is almost totally demilitarised; I don't see much evidence of any supposed war going on

no PIRA's war is over, theyve bowed, been broken, and are defeated. as for the rest of the men they continue to fulfill their promises as best they can ATM. and the demilitarisation is a joke as britain could have its soldiers back in ireland tomorrow out in full strength and you know it. all they need is their little spy post their building (with the consent of PSF obviously as they are now part of the 6's gov.) and they effectively have a stranglehold around the 6 and who knows how much further their reach may go into the 26.

[East Tyrone]

Ciaran we could argue much of what you wrote all day and get nowhere as we have such differant viewpoints and we've been over it before. However, I will pick up on this;
and the demilitarisation is a joke as britain could have its soldiers back in ireland tomorrow out in full strength and you know
It would cost the Brits millions to remilitarise, they have demolished nearly all their facilities and sold off the land. Much of their manpower and vehicles are deployed in Asia. If Ireland missions were added for tens of thousands of troops it would cut time between deployments and increase the burden on troops and their families. The British public would be less likely to aquiesce than they have in the past, particularly in light of the Iraq experience. Now bearing all this in mind and considering that there are those who allegedly strive to drive the Brits out of Ireland through armed struggle; where is the war?

[Foyleview]

East Tyrone. some great points a chara. its forward we need to go not back!

[RSF-Fianoglach]

east tyrone it is people like you that have brought PSF reputation down to the lowest form,and dragged it through the mud,you are simply a cowardly type of man,and i know by your posts on this forum,that if there was an all out war tomorrow on this island you would scarper with your tail between your legs,grow a set,and join a republican party and actualy contribute something to the cause,instead of slobbering on internet forums all day.

[East Tyrone]

tomas, your opinion of me won't exactly cause any great loss of sleep.

[belfast rep]

east tyrone it is people like you that have brought PSF reputation down to the lowest form,and dragged it through the mud,you are simply a cowardly type of man,and i know by your posts on this forum,that if there was an all out war tomorrow on this island you would scarper with your tail between your legs,grow a set,and join a republican party and actualy contribute something to the cause,instead of slobbering on internet forums all day.


RSF must celebrate the day you joined

[RSF-Fianoglach]

Belfast Rep sarcasm doesnt become you,but in reply to your post i didnt join RSF for there approval i joined because they seem to be the only republicans who stand by there principles and dont bow to brit/free state pressure or monetery gain,and are constantly campaigning on the ground to highlight the futility of the GFA/sunningdale agreement.can the same be said of your PSF.?

[East Tyrone]

Belfast Rep sarcasm doesnt become you,but in reply to your post i didnt join RSF for there approval i joined because they seem to be the only republicans who stand by there principles and dont bow to brit/free state pressure or monetery gain,and are constantly campaigning on the ground to highlight the futility of the GFA/sunningdale agreement.can the same be said of your PSF.?

The other 9 members say you're not one of them; Scarface checked, he knows them all.

[RSF-Fianoglach]

hahhaha very good,at least im a wannabe member of RSF which is more honourable than you being a wannabe member of PSF.

[rsfarmagh/keady]

I'd like to see them and the contos stand down, decommission and enter the political process. I know that about 99% of the Irish people feel the same way.

Catch a grip of yourself just cause the psf have sold the people down the river doesnt mean well have all been taken for a ride ! While the brits and the Brit establishment remain in the North of Ireland there will always be a Restistance Movement fighting for the goal that your party sold out, A UNITED IRELAND

[East Tyrone]

Hmm the eejits are out in force, like a herd of muppets.

[belfast rep]

hahhaha very good,at least im a wannabe member of RSF which is more honourable than you being a wannabe member of PSF.

but you not a wanna be liar, your a real one Enoch

[belfast rep]

Catch a grip of yourself just cause the psf have sold the people down the river doesnt mean well have all been taken for a ride ! While the brits and the Brit establishment remain in the North of Ireland there will always be a Restistance Movement fighting for the goal that your party sold out, A UNITED IRELAND

where the resistance Milltown and Ardoyne

[RSF-Fianoglach]

belfast rep your wit is so ripping and effective.........NOT!

[belfast rep]

Belfast Rep sarcasm doesnt become you,but in reply to your post i didnt join RSF for there approval i joined because they seem to be the only republicans who stand by there principles and dont bow to brit/free state pressure or monetery gain,and are constantly campaigning on the ground to highlight the futility of the GFA/sunningdale agreement.can the same be said of your PSF.?

is it not against the bibles teachings to lie godboy

[RSF-Fianoglach]

i am not a liar,i just wasnt rising to ET obvious attempt to start an argument

[RSF-Fianoglach]

and keep the godboy stuff to yourself,grow up.

[belfast rep]

i am not a liar,i just wasnt rising to ET obvious attempt to start an argument
you claim to be a member of RSF and then when they disown you, you claim to be a RSF wanna member ( or reject) i think that makes you a liar godboy

[broche]

i voted loyalists because the previous measurable campaign they killed a large number of Catholic civilians and in my opinion anyway the IRA firstmost priority is the protection of the nationalist population. only after a the loyalist threat has been dealt with or is managable in the strictest terms, should attention be focused upon the brits/ruc

[RSF-Fianoglach]

belfast rep,do you realy think the few lads on here from RSF know every single member of the organisation?

[RSF-Fianoglach]

belfast rep the boy who likes to swing left,i am no liar.you are the liar for calling me a liar.now ****k off

[belfast rep]

Belfast Rep sarcasm doesnt become you,but in reply to your post i didnt join RSF for there approval i joined because they seem to be the only republicans who stand by there principles and dont bow to brit/free state pressure or monetery gain,and are constantly campaigning on the ground to highlight the futility of the GFA/sunningdale agreement.can the same be said of your PSF.?
hahhaha very good,at least im a wannabe member of RSF which is more honourable than you being a wannabe member of PSF

i rest my case
check the commandments godboy

[RSF-Fianoglach]

well belfast rep i am a sinner,but guess what my sins are paid for through the messiahs sacrifice,so i am saved and will go to heaven through faith in the lord,but you on the other hand will die in your sins,unless you accept jesus into your heart and ask for forgivness.

[East Tyrone]

What has Jesus got to do with the future of the RIRA?

[quirk]

What has Jesus got to do with the future of the RIRA?

East Tyrone is right. Try to keep it on topic.

[ciaranxavier]

Ciaran we could argue much of what you wrote all day and get nowhere as we have such differant viewpoints and we've been over it before. However, I will pick up on this;

It would cost the Brits millions to remilitarise, they have demolished nearly all their facilities and sold off the land. Much of their manpower and vehicles are deployed in Asia. If Ireland missions were added for tens of thousands of troops it would cut time between deployments and increase the burden on troops and their families. The British public would be less likely to aquiesce than they have in the past, particularly in light of the Iraq experience. Now bearing all this in mind and considering that there are those who allegedly strive to drive the Brits out of Ireland through armed struggle; where is the war?

Ciaran we could argue much of what you wrote all day and get nowhere as we have such differant viewpoints and we've been over it before. However, I will pick up on this;

lol i agree we seem to get stuck in these gridlocks of polar opposite viewpoints.

It would cost the Brits millions to remilitarise, they have demolished nearly all their facilities and sold off the land.

the majority of dismantling has been the listening posts i believe, and those were obsolete in this day and age especially with the new intelligence building being built.

Much of their manpower and vehicles are deployed in Asia.

why?

where is the war?

occupied 6

[ciaranxavier]

i voted loyalists because the previous measurable campaign they killed a large number of Catholic civilians and in my opinion anyway the IRA firstmost priority is the protection of the nationalist population. only after a the loyalist threat has been dealt with or is managable in the strictest terms, should attention be focused upon the brits/ruc

ya lets go after minor problems well the major issue hasnt been resolved.

[Deckie]

belfast rep,

is it not against the bibles teachings to lie godboy

Please stop calling him godboy

[East Tyrone]

Ciaran we could argue much of what you wrote all day and get nowhere as we have such differant viewpoints and we've been over it before. However, I will pick up on this;

lol i agree we seem to get stuck in these gridlocks of polar opposite viewpoints.

It would cost the Brits millions to remilitarise, they have demolished nearly all their facilities and sold off the land.

the majority of dismantling has been the listening posts i believe, and those were obsolete in this day and age especially with the new intelligence building being built.

Much of their manpower and vehicles are deployed in Asia.

why?

where is the war?

occupied 6

Ciaran they have dismantled all their checkpoints and most of their bases; I don't think they have a base left in Tyrone. Near me the two in Dungannon and one in Aughnacloy are gone. If they were to remilitarise they would have to reaquire land and build new bases; which would cost millions.
Much of their manpower, multi-purpose patrol vehicles and helicopters are tied up with their Iraq and Afghanistan commitments.
When I said "where is the war?" Ciaran, I meant where is the evidence of it. There are no Brit patrols, choppers are a rarity and the police are driving around in unarmoured patrol cars; much like Canadian police cruisers. There is nothing to suggest that any kind of active resistance exists.

[Takeshi]

I have no doubt that there are many dedicated Republicans within the RIRA and 32CSM, and for that reason I honestly wish that they would call a ceasefire. Continuing with an armed campaign that has absolutely no chance of achieving its desired goal is indefensible. All that will be achieved is that good men and women and going to spend long terms in prison, or be killed. If they do succeed in killing a few cops driving home from work. Does anyone think that the brit cabinet will lose any sleep over some cop in Derry? The only difference it will make is to leave some kids without a father.

The idea that an armed campaign could militarily drive the brits from the north died at Loughgall. Even with the impressive resources that the Provos had at hand, they couldn't do it, and what chance does a even smaller, less well armed group have? In addition to this, there just isn't any support within the Nationalist community for another armed campaign. People are more worried about job security and paying their mortgage to worry about partition. The RIRA might think this is their 1969, to launch a new war against the brits, but it looks more like 1956.

Since the GFA, the fate of the six counties is no longer in the hands of the british government. An armed campaign to force them to declare an intent to withdraw or petitioning the UN is irrelevant now that unity will only come with the support of at least a section of the Protestant community. There will be a serious trust issue while they see photos of AK wielding Republicans. Ending the violence and creating a real political platform to reach out to Protestants, and giving them a reason to be a part of our shared Irishness is the only way they will ever be a part of the Irish nation.

[East Tyrone]

I have no doubt that there are many dedicated Republicans within the RIRA and 32CSM, and for that reason I honestly wish that they would call a ceasefire. Continuing with an armed campaign that has absolutely no chance of achieving its desired goal is indefensible. All that will be achieved is that good men and women and going to spend long terms in prison, or be killed. If they do succeed in killing a few cops driving home from work. Does anyone think that the brit cabinet will lose any sleep over some cop in Derry? The only difference it will make is to leave some kids without a father.
Very true, when you kill a cop you are also affecting the lives of his family. They don't just get "rubbed out" as Dan Breen, used to say; there is a legacy of grief and anger for a number of people. They too are victims.

The idea that an armed campaign could militarily drive the brits from the north died at Loughgall. Even with the impressive resources that the Provos had at hand, they couldn't do it, and what chance does a even smaller, less well armed group have? In addition to this, there just isn't any support within the Nationalist community for another armed campaign. People are more worried about job security and paying their mortgage to worry about partition. The RIRA might think this is their 1969, to launch a new war against the brits, but it looks more like 1956.
The Loughgall men were great soldiers, daring and dedicated; but they were exceptional men. As were many others who struggled; but the gear came too late. Had it have come after Bloody Sunday or the Hunger Strike there could have been something capable of forcing UN intervention; but thousands woulds have died.
The so called militants constantly use 1956 as some type of legitimising factor; serious liberties are taken with the memories of the dead. The Brits hadn't 30 odd years of state of the art 1st world counter-insugency experience in 1956. There had been a measure of success for armed rebellion against the Brits in living memory and the world was a much simpler place. There is zero possibilty of the present so-called militants achieving anything of significance through force of arms. It is a total fraud to believe otherwise and anyone who does is being taken for a ride.

Since the GFA, the fate of the six counties is no longer in the hands of the british government. An armed campaign to force them to declare an intent to withdraw or petitioning the UN is irrelevant now that unity will only come with the support of at least a section of the Protestant community. There will be a serious trust issue while they see photos of AK wielding Republicans. Ending the violence and creating a real political platform to reach out to Protestants, and giving them a reason to be a part of our shared Irishness is the only way they will ever be a part of the Irish nation.
The Brits won't give up easy I think they will keep the pot well stirred. The Orange Hall burnings are an example; nobody knows the culprits but Republicans get the blame. Some Unionists believe that the RIRA is a cover-name for the Provos. The Brits can pull stuff like this all the time as long as they have a bogeyman to pin it on in the eyes of ordinary, decent Protestants.

[Seabird]

East Tyrone,

The Brits won't give up easy I think they will keep the pot well stirred. The Orange Hall burnings are an example; nobody knows the culprits but Republicans get the blame. Some Unionists believe that the RIRA is a cover-name for the Provos. The Brits can pull stuff like this all the time as long as they have a bogeyman to pin it on in the eyes of ordinary, decent Protestants.

I don't believe it is a matter of giving up, I believe they would gladly throw in the towel if they didn't have to deal with the economics of leaving the 6 high and dry. I do however believe that they like to keep the pot stirred then sit back and watch action. A friend died about 3 weeks ago, a good man, not a man that many would know unless they worked with him, he was a good soldier. Why was special branch at the funeral, what purpose did it serve? Nothing more than to let everyone know they have not gone away, stir up some mess so to speak!

Takeshi,

I liked yer post and agree with most of what you have said. If the REALS could accomplish the task the reunification after an armed campaign, how do they expect the people to live when England no longer places money into the economy and the south won't give up much? The health care is in a shamble in the south, the minimum wage is too low for the cost of living and people are finding it hard to obtain employment. There is no socialized medicine so everyone must pay for health care unless on social services and that is going to be revamped. I just do not believe they realize how costly the move is going to be for the south to take over the deficit for the 6. It is going to take alot of economic building inorder to start the transition or it will bring economic hardship on the entire isle. This isn't just about beating the brits out of Ireland but laying the foundations for survival once they are gone. People want to snicker at McGuinness and Paisley going to America drumming up corporate help but IMHO that was a sound move toward solving the issues of money. The north needs to become self sufficient, that could be the road to freedom from british rule.

[belfast rep]

belfast rep,



Please stop calling him godboy

why? is he not a god boy?
would you rather i called him clanman
i am a republican so i have republican in my name
you call me republican boy/man or provo/boy/man
he used names to describe my politics or said very silly boy no big deal (apart from a bit camp)
he has used other names for example i seem to remember he called Carlos a poof
god boy one of the least offence names i have seen here, i would be more offended by Enoch but maybe is proud of that name

[belfast rep]

why? is he not a god boy?
would you rather i called him clanman
i am a republican so i have republican in my name
you call me republican boy/man or provo/boy/man
he used names to describe my politics or said very silly boy no big deal (apart from a bit camp)
he has used other names for example i seem to remember he called Carlos a poof
god boy one of the least offence names i have seen here, i would be more offended by Enoch but maybe is proud of that name


and i call him a liar as well much worst than godboy.

[Hildy]

and i call him a liar as well much worst than godboy.

Oh, republican boy....LOL!:wave: Just to take things back on topic, did you see the poll is neck o' neck. Very close, indeed. Everyone needs to vote!

[ciaranxavier]

Oh, republican boy....LOL!:wave: Just to take things back on topic, did you see the poll is neck o' neck. Very close, indeed. Everyone needs to vote!

a renewed campaign is two ahead. i wonder if this could be a valid survey.

[Hildy]

a renewed campaign is two ahead. i wonder if this could be a valid survey.

I don't know.....it could be cx! I thought SF supporters were in the majority around here, but by the looks of the poll, either they are not, OR, not all of them are voting. This is very interesting.

[ciaranxavier]

I don't know.....it could be cx! I thought SF supporters were in the majority around here, but by the looks of the poll, either they are not, OR, not all of them are voting. This is very interesting.

or not all of them agree with a total disarmament. and support going politically with a military presence.

[Hildy]

or not all of them agree with a total disarmament. and support going politically with a military presence.

Well, I would think SF supporters would surely vote for the RIRA to stand down, perhaps I'm wrong.

[robertemmett]

Oh, republican boy....LOL!:wave: Just to take things back on topic, did you see the poll is neck o' neck. Very close, indeed. Everyone needs to vote!


do they NEED to vote????
is it vital ???

are the army council of the rIRA sitting around waiting expectantly on the outcome of poll on IR.net. chewing their nails, drinking endless cups of coffee and chain smoking malboro reds????

oh... what will it be????

[Hildy]

do they NEED to vote????
is it vital ???

are the army council of the rIRA sitting around waiting expectantly on the outcome of poll on IR.net. chewing their nails, drinking endless cups of coffee and chain smoking malboro reds????

oh... what will it be????

Did someone wind you up today, robert? You are just full of the barbs aren't you?:) Don't you think it interesting to see how members are voting on this thread? It's not earth shattering but I feel its a thumb on the pulse of those that have voted. May I ask how you cast your vote? No, let me guess.....Renewed Armed Campaign against the Brits, right?

[robertemmett]

Did someone wind you up today, robert? You are just full of the barbs aren't you?:) Don't you think it interesting to see how members are voting on this thread? It's not earth shattering but I feel its a thumb on the pulse of those that have voted. May I ask how you cast your vote? No, let me guess.....Renewed Armed Campaign against the Brits, right?

good evening hildy, how are you?:eusa_dance:

[Hildy]

good evening hildy, how are you?:eusa_dance:

Thank you sir, good evening to you too! I'm just lovely! So am I right? Or did you vote?

[robertemmett]

Thank you sir, good evening to you too! I'm just lovely! So am I right? Or did you vote?


indeed i did, more than once too, but then i voted early you see. like the psfers were in cavan/monaghan last year.

[East Tyrone]

indeed i did, more than once too, but then i voted early you see. like the psfers were in cavan/monaghan last year.

Wouldn't matter how early you rose and how often you voted if the 32s stood in elections; they'd still lose their deposits, just like the contos.

[RSF-Fianoglach]

east tyrone you keep slobbering about the contos,but think about it,even if you dont agree with there politics they are still irish men and women willing to lay there lives on the line for irish unity,please show a bit more respect and im sure it will be returned to you.

[East Tyrone]

east tyrone you keep slobbering about the contos,but think about it,even if you dont agree with there politics they are still irish men and women willing to lay there lives on the line for irish unity,please show a bit more respect and im sure it will be returned to you.

Those who would indoctrinate the youth into losing or wasting their lives in pursuit of bankrupt ideology, at the mercy of the likes of Paddy Murray and Gareth O Connor, are not worthy of respect imo.

[ciaranxavier]

Well, I would think SF supporters would surely vote for the RIRA to stand down, perhaps I'm wrong.

oh really i never wouldve thunk that considering they disarmed their own army to work under the foreigners army.

[quirk]

Those who would indoctrinate the youth into losing or wasting their lives in pursuit of bankrupt ideology, at the mercy of the likes of Paddy Murray and Gareth O Connor, are not worthy of respect imo.

Their ideology is republicanism.

[East Tyrone]

Their ideology is republicanism.

Their ideology is violent, militant Republicanism; which is a redundant strategy. It is only one aspect of Republicanism; albeit a failed and counter-productive aspect.

[quirk]

The idelogy is republicanism. Armed action is a tactic.

[East Tyrone]

Your ideology and strategy will be corrupt and futile for as long as it is considered a viable tactic.

[ciaranxavier]

Your ideology and strategy will be corrupt and futile for as long as it is considered a viable tactic.

i agree with quirk and you guys must be as corrupt and futile for you considered it a viable tactic.

[East Tyrone]

i agree with quirk and you guys must be as corrupt and futile for you considered it a viable tactic.

The Republican movement realised the futility of armed militancy; that's why they no longer engage in it.

[RSF-Fianoglach]

The Republican movement realised the futility of armed militancy; that's why they no longer engage in it.


east tyrone the last time i checked the Republican Movement RSF still support armed struggle,you must be confusing RSF with Judas Sinn Fein aka PSF

[East Tyrone]

east tyrone the last time i checked the Republican Movement RSF still support armed struggle,you must be confusing RSF with Judas Sinn Fein aka PSF

Tomas looking confused.
http://www.fathertedonline.ukf.net/Images/videostills/thumbnails/thumbjackstartled.jpg

[RSF-Fianoglach]

east tyrone,west brit,please stop acting like a twit.
stop spouting shiite,and talking crap
or ill drag you from your bush,and give you a slap.

[mickyk200]

I would half support the RIRA if they policed there areas in a proper way. Like the PIRA did in say Derry and Belfast. The RIRA is mainly composed of lads who aren't in it for the long run, just because they missed their chance to make an impact during the Troubles they think that shooting a random peeler in the Creggan or the Bogside in 2008 with strike fear into the Brits...It won't.

[quirk]

The RIRA is mainly composed of lads who aren't in it for the long run, just because they missed their chance to make an impact during the Troubles they think that shooting a random peeler in the Creggan or the Bogside in 2008 with strike fear into the Brits...It won't.

From where do you arrive at this conclusion?

[mickyk200]

From where do you arrive at this conclusion?
me own sincre opinion mr quirk

[East Tyrone]

east tyrone,west brit,please stop acting like a twit.
stop spouting shiite,and talking crap
or ill drag you from your bush,and give you a slap.

The only thing you would be liable to slap would be rarely, if ever, near a bush.

[quirk]

me own sincre opinion mr quirk

But I just dont see how you can arrive at the opinion that it is composed mainly of lads in it for the short term because they missed their chance before.

[ciaranxavier]

The Republican movement realised the futility of armed militancy; that's why they no longer engage in it.

but you engaged in it making you the same things you call us. just because youve changed tactics doesnt erase your past decisions.

[ciaranxavier]

I would half support the RIRA if they policed there areas in a proper way. Like the PIRA did in say Derry and Belfast. The RIRA is mainly composed of lads who aren't in it for the long run, just because they missed their chance to make an impact during the Troubles they think that shooting a random peeler in the Creggan or the Bogside in 2008 with strike fear into the Brits...It won't.

how are they going to police their areas AND continue an armed campaign against a superpower?

[mickyk200]

But I just dont see how you can arrive at the opinion that it is composed mainly of lads in it for the short term because they missed their chance before.
well prove me wrong...

[quirk]

well prove me wrong...

How could I possibly do that? Interview every RIRA volunteer and publish the results here maybe?

If you make an assertion then the onus is on you to prove it. That's just common sense.

[mickyk200]

How could I possibly do that? Interview every RIRA volunteer and publish the results here maybe?

If you make an assertion then the onus is on you to prove it. That's just common sense.
My opinion is based on the fact that you cannot interview every RIRA volenteer, because it cannot be disproved.
If you could show me evidence to the contrary I would change my opinion. No evidenece, no case.

[quirk]

My opinion is based on the fact that you cannot interview every RIRA volenteer, because it cannot be disproved.
If you could show me evidence to the contrary I would change my opinion. No evidenece, no case.

Your not getting what I am saying. I don't have to prove you wrong. If I said to you that the majority people who ever joined the IRA were sectarian and if you can prove me wrong I will change my opinion you would correctly ask me to show my evidence to support my initial assertion. My assertion would be invalid until I did so. The same would go for any other claim I could make such as there really is fairies or the earth will end in 5 years. Would any of these things be true because of the fact that you couldn't prove me wrong on them? (which you can't)

You have formed an opinion from nowhere. You might not be able to interview them all but have you interviewed a large number of them or is this even true for the RIRA volunteers that you personally know?

I find it funny that you end with "no evidence no case":icon_lol:

[East Tyrone]

Quirk, do you believe that the RIRA can make any realistic gains that would justify persistance with armed tactics?

[quirk]

Quirk, do you believe that the RIRA can make any realistic gains that would justify persistance with armed tactics?

I believe that certain armed actions can have tactical benefits. However the British presence in Ireland is mainly political and any opposition to it should be mainly political in nature.

[mickyk200]

Your not getting what I am saying. I don't have to prove you wrong. If I said to you that the majority people who ever joined the IRA were sectarian and if you can prove me wrong I will change my opinion you would correctly ask me to show my evidence to support my initial assertion. My assertion would be invalid until I did so. The same would go for any other claim I could make such as there really is fairies or the earth will end in 5 years. Would any of these things be true because of the fact that you couldn't prove me wrong on them? (which you can't)

You have formed an opinion from nowhere. You might not be able to interview them all but have you interviewed a large number of them or is this even true for the RIRA volunteers that you personally know?

I find it funny that you end with "no evidence no case":icon_lol:
hold on hold on...there's a flaw in your logic
are you comparing the determination of RIRA volenteers to fairies or to the world ending?

within reason the idea that if it cannot be disproved means it holds some ground...fairies aren't within reason my dear quirk. =P

[East Tyrone]

I believe that certain armed actions can have tactical benefits. However the British presence in Ireland is mainly political and any opposition to it should be mainly political in nature.

That's a fudge answer if ever I heard one; there is nothing that the RIRA are capable of doing, through armed action, that can deliver any type of positive political advantage; particularly when they don't have a recognised political representation or quantifiable mandate. All opposition to the British presence in Ireland should be purely political. The RIRA have no useful part to play in the opposition to the British presence in Ireland and their actions serve only to secure it.

[quirk]

hold on hold on...there's a flaw in your logic
are you comparing the determination of RIRA volenteers to fairies or to the world ending?

within reason the idea that if it cannot be disproved means it holds some ground...fairies aren't within reason my dear quirk. =P

You have ignored the basic point. You are the one expected to provide evidence. Even say from where your assumption arose. If I claimed then that the PIRA army council are all MI5 agents would that hold ground then simply on the fact that you can't disprove it?

[mickyk200]

You have ignored the basic point. You are the one expected to provide evidence. Even say from where your assumption arose. If I claimed then that the PIRA army council are all MI5 agents would that hold ground then simply on the fact that you can't disprove it?
it was my opinion and I admitted to that...Ishouldn't have to provide facts because you disagree.

aye had to slip a wee bit of shinner bashing in there...good lad quirk, way to hold up your side ;]

[quirk]

it was my opinion and I admitted to that...Ishouldn't have to provide facts because you disagree.

aye had to slip a wee bit of shinner bashing in there...good lad quirk, way to hold up your side ;]

Theres no shinner bashing in my post. I gave an example which clearly isn't true in my opinion to show my point.

I know that it is your opinion but opinions must be formed from somewhere. You didn't just wake up one day and decide the majority of RIRA volunteers are only in it for the short term.

[ciaranxavier]

micky you didnt answer my question.

[mickyk200]

Theres no shinner bashing in my post. I gave an example which clearly isn't true in my opinion to show my point.

I know that it is your opinion but opinions must be formed from somewhere. You didn't just wake up one day and decide the majority of RIRA volunteers are only in it for the short term.
Because the majority of volenteers are retardedly patriotic and around 20 years of age that would draw me to that conclusion.

Refering to the SF leadership as MI5 agents isn't shinner bashing to you?

[mickyk200]

micky you didnt answer my question.
sorry I never noticed it...
I don't want them to "attack" Britian, if that's what you call shooting random peelers. PS. Britian isn't a superpower these days.

The PIRA managed to juggle policing their own communities and withstain a constant attack on the crown forces. If you lads are the gallent unstoppable freedom fighters you make yourself out to be then why can't you?

[quirk]

Because the majority of volenteers are retardedly patriotic and around 20 years of age that would draw me to that conclusion.

Refering to the SF leadership as MI5 agents isn't shinner bashing to you?

Where did I say that they were MI5 agents. I said IF they were. I did this merely to make a point.

Again you have no evidence to say the majority are in their early 20's or "retardedly patriotic" and I am simply wondering how you jump to such conclusions. And even if they were in their early 20's how does this allow you to make the further conclusion that they are only in it for the short term?

[mickyk200]

Where did I say that they were MI5 agents. I said IF they were. I did this merely to make a point.

Again you have no evidence to say the majority are in their early 20's or "retardedly patriotic" and I am simply wondering how you jump to such conclusions. And even if they were in their early 20's how does this allow you to make the further conclusion that they are only in it for the short term?
here's how I came two those two conclusions:-

under 20's- You will agree that most PIRA volenteers abandoned all military actvity after the GFA, with a minority of volenteers joining the RIRA and CIRA. Only a small fraction of RIRA volenteers would be ex-provos. Meaning they would have recruited new men and women, most of which were too young to have joined the provos before the GFAm, thus being around 20 years of age.

Retardedly patriotic- Because they continue there useless military operations despite the well being of their own community and the people of the north on the whole but they do this all in the name of republicanism.

[Hessian Peel]

Retardedly patriotic- Because they continue there useless military operations despite the well being of their own community and the people of the north on the whole but they do this all in the name of republicanism.

Sounds exactly like the pre-1997 Provisional IRA to me.

Still have the INLA avatar I see....even though you don't support the politics of the IRSM.

Goodman yourself. :)

[mickyk200]

Sounds exactly like the pre-1997 Provisional IRA to me.

Still have the INLA avatar I see....even though you don't support the politics of the IRSM.

Goodman yourself. :)
Not really, compare the suppoprt and numbers of the pre-GFA provos to that of the CIRA or RIRA nowadays.

I don't totally disagree with the IRSM or the INLA. I think the INLA did the nationalist people a great service by dispatching that waste of w*nk Billy Wright. But OFF TOPIC!

[Carlos McJackle]

here's how I came two those two conclusions:-

under 20's- You will agree that most PIRA volenteers abandoned all military actvity after the GFA, with a minority of volenteers joining the RIRA and CIRA. Only a small fraction of RIRA volenteers would be ex-provos. Meaning they would have recruited new men and women, most of which were too young to have joined the provos before the GFAm, thus being around 20 years of age.

Retardedly patriotic- Because they continue there useless military operations despite the well being of their own community and the people of the north on the whole but they do this all in the name of republicanism.

I wouldnt agree . firstly because round here they recruited very heavily post gfa . particularly when an entire battalion essentially took the decision to constitute the RIRA , leaving the current OC of south armagh with about 2 individuals under his command in his own district . the people they recruited went on to be the leg breakers and mutilators , in the name of republicanism , who have successfully dragged the name of this area through the mud since 1998 and introduced a civil war mentality in every pub in the district . A district in ehich no kneecappings took place throughout the entire conflict .

your conclusions seem to be based also on a theory that unless you were a member of an insurgent group in a previous campaign you have no right to take up arms against the occupation of your country following the unsuccessful end of that campaign . Thats absolutely ridiculous . Following that logic anyone who was too young to fight in 1916 was a retard for taking up arms 5 years later .

One advantage us older hairier guys have though is that we virtually grew up listening to this very same stuff , week in week out from nationalists and supposed republicans . It was fed to us as propaganda on a daily basis in order to demean and demonise our political position . we ignored it then and we'll damn sure ignore it now . With the benefit of age I have the right to point this out .

[mickyk200]

I wouldnt agree . firstly because round here they recruited very heavily post gfa . particularly when an entire battalion essentially took the decision to constitute the RIRA , leaving the current OC of south armagh with about 2 individuals under his command in his own district . the people they recruited went on to be the leg breakers and mutilators , in the name of republicanism , who have successfully dragged the name of this area through the mud since 1998 and introduced a civil war mentality in every pub in the district . A district in ehich no kneecappings took place throughout the entire conflict .

your conclusions seem to be based also on a theory that unless you were a member of an insurgent group in a previous campaign you have no right to take up arms against the occupation of your country following the unsuccessful end of that campaign . Thats absolutely ridiculous . Following that logic anyone who was too young to fight in 1916 was a retard for taking up arms 5 years later .

One advantage us older hairier guys have though is that we virtually grew up listening to this very same stuff , week in week out from nationalists and supposed republicans . It was fed to us as propaganda on a daily basis in order to demean and demonise our political position . we ignored it then and we'll damn sure ignore it now . With the benefit of age I have the right to point this out .
Then you agree that they recruited new people after the GFA, meaning that people who were not possible candidates for joining any IRA before the GFA...Thus new recruits generally being less that 30 years of age. From what you've told me the presence of the RIRA has devided south armagh in mentality...Surely this would be an arguement against them.

No that's not the theory I'm working on at all. My point being that joining any paramilitary group, either loyalist or republican gave you a certain authority in your own community during the Troubles, I'm sure you would agree. These younger men missed out this oppertunity so joining the RIRA inflates their sense of authority. Taking up arms in 1921 was justified, not in 2008. There was no alternetive in 1921 and the British government was a complete tyrant, I'm not saying that they still aren't tyrannical but surely you'll agree nationalists have a better standard of living that 80 or 90 years ago.

I'm not saying that age reflects how logical your political ideals are, but it sure as f*ck determines your ability to determine the saftey of others.

[Hessian Peel]

I don't totally disagree with the IRSM or the INLA.

I probably don't completely disagree with every DUP policy, but that doesn't mean I support them.

You're a gas man altogether. :hmmm:

[mickyk200]

I probably don't completely disagree with every DUP policy, but that doesn't mean I support them.

You're a gas man altogether. :hmmm:
I would hope for a 32 county socialist state, I consider myself a follower of Connelly.
What stops me from supporting the INLA and IRSP is that the INLA continue to carry out irrevalant operations especially down south, also their numbers and popularity. I would prefer to acheive national liberation before socialism. Surely you would agree it would be better to untied the country and set up socialism in the near future rather than struggle for another 800 years to kill 2 birds with one stone.
Sínn Féin have the numbers and the popularity so they are the most likely candidates to acieve unity at this rate of going, despite their petty bourgoise ideals. Unity first, after which I'll switch my allegence.

But like I said....OFF TOPIC!!

[Carlos McJackle]

[QUOTE]Then you agree that they recruited new people after the GFA, meaning that people who were not possible candidates for joining any IRA before the GFA...Thus new recruits generally being less that 30 years of age.

you seem to be saying they should only have recruited in the upper age brackets....i really fail to see your point here

From what you've told me the presence of the RIRA has devided south armagh in mentality...Surely this would be an arguement against them.

no . the leg breakers pretty much adopted a civil war mentality towards anyone who wasnt in sinn fein . sdlp members , ex sticks , someone theyd went to school with and didnt like .. all were derided for " not being there" by a crowd of yahoos who...werent there . Often to their faces When the truth was even a few of them had very definitely been there but didnt brag about it , particulalry the ex-sticks . Older people would have known this . But regardless of that its still a pile of shyte talk in a pub . Prior to 98 youd have been expelled . Insults against republicans who were there were usually reserved for when their backs were turned . It most definitely was not the RIRA that introduced this mentality into our district . Or the mutilations .


No that's not the theory I'm working on at all. My point being that joining any paramilitary group, either loyalist or republican gave you a certain authority in your own community during the Troubles, I'm sure you would agree.

round here prior to 98 if you were a PIRA volunteer and someone busted you in a pub you had to suck it up like any other schmoe . That was a firm rule here in south armagh . Post 98 you could smash their arms and legs to pieces .

These younger men missed out this oppertunity so joining the RIRA inflates their sense of authority.

No , if they wanted to strut about the place they could just join the provos . Who were pretty desperate for recruits in some areas and recruited very heavily .

Taking up arms in 1921 was justified, not in 2008.

rubbish . Our country is occupied , our sovereignty violated . thats the only justification necessary for taking up arms

There was no alternetive in 1921

yes there was . All Irish nationalists had precisely the same voting rights as people in england . Home rule of some kind was on offer without a shot being fired . its all they got after 1921 anyway . No more autonomy was gained in 1922 than had not a single shot been fired

and the British government was a complete tyrant,

hardly . when King George of england visted Ireland in the early 20th century half the country was out waving union jacks . Many thousands were happily joining the British army even before WW1 . When it came they didnt subject Ireland to conscription unlike the rest of the UK It only executed a handful of rebels in 1916 . and again in the war for Independence . It only resorted to co-ercion in the face of attempts to establish Irish sovereignty . Only for that itd have been happy to treat the Irish just like the english . Better even bearing in mind conscription .
your problem seems to be the perceived manner of British rule in ireland , as opposed to the fact of it .

I'm not saying that they still aren't tyrannical but surely you'll agree nationalists have a better standard of living that 80 or 90 years ago.

what has standard of living got to do with the fact Britian has no right to occupy Irish territory ?

I'm not saying that age reflects how logical your political ideals are, but it sure as f*ck determines your ability to determine the saftey of others

Michael McVerry and his comrades were in their late teens and early 20s when they held commanding officer positions within the south armagh brigade . British soldiers were happily drinking in the pubs with locals and not terrorising them in the slightest when they took the decison to start killing them . take a look at the average age of the hungerstrikers while your at it .

[RepublicanTom1916]

but could the Real IRA begin a renewed campaign does any one no of there numbers and arsenal they are by no means have the capability of the Provos of the 70's and 80's ?

[Carlos McJackle]

alison morris of the Irish news seems to have some amazing insghts in that regard

[Carlos McJackle]

I would hope for a 32 county socialist state, I consider myself a follower of Connelly.
What stops me from supporting the INLA and IRSP is that the INLA continue to carry out irrevalant operations especially down south, also their numbers and popularity. I would prefer to acheive national liberation before socialism. Surely you would agree it would be better to untied the country and set up socialism in the near future rather than struggle for another 800 years to kill 2 birds with one stone.
Sínn Féin have the numbers and the popularity so they are the most likely candidates to acieve unity at this rate of going, despite their petty bourgoise ideals. Unity first, after which I'll switch my allegence.

But like I said....OFF TOPIC!!

at this rate of going sinn fein wont have a seat in leinster house in 8 years time , much like the workers party before them . Their party president has proven himself to be an electoral liability rather then an asset south of the border simply due to his ginorance on economic issues and inability to construct an argument during a live debate . And its petit , not petty ..

[mickyk200]

[quote=mickyk200;55532]


[QUOTE]
you seem to be saying they should only have recruited in the upper age brackets....i really fail to see your point here
No, but a force made up mostly men still filled with the pride of youth can not be perfectly sensible in their actions

no . the leg breakers pretty much adopted a civil war mentality towards anyone who wasnt in sinn fein . sdlp members , ex sticks , someone theyd went to school with and didnt like .. all were derided for " not being there" by a crowd of yahoos who...werent there . Often to their faces When the truth was even a few of them had very definitely been there but didnt brag about it , particulalry the ex-sticks . Older people would have known this . But regardless of that its still a pile of shyte talk in a pub . Prior to 98 youd have been expelled . Insults against republicans who were there were usually reserved for when their backs were turned . It most definitely was not the RIRA that introduced this mentality into our district . Or the mutilations .
I accept that the provos were by no means rightoues in every area and in every operation. They may have introduced this divide but as far as I know the RIRA have done nothing to reverse these situation.




round here prior to 98 if you were a PIRA volunteer and someone busted you in a pub you had to suck it up like any other schmoe . That was a firm rule here in south armagh . Post 98 you could smash their arms and legs to pieces
Do you think every provo was completly selfless in their actions? Ballix they were! Volenteers of all walks of republicanism have used their psotions for personal means, not one of greed more of a persoanl nature. Sorting out would-be boyfriends to daughters etc.


No , if they wanted to strut about the place they could just join the provos . Who were pretty desperate for recruits in some areas and recruited very heavily .
And the RIRA are picky about who they recruit?



rubbish . Our country is occupied , our sovereignty violated . thats the only justification necessary for taking up arms
Your justification is questionable, and I think you'll find the majority of mainsteam republicans would disagree with this "justifcation"


yes there was . All Irish nationalists had precisely the same voting rights as people in england . Home rule of some kind was on offer without a shot being fired . its all they got after 1921 anyway . No more autonomy was gained in 1922 than had not a single shot been fired
I think you'd need to open a book.


hardly . when King George of england visted Ireland in the early 20th century half the country was out waving union jacks . Many thousands were happily joining the British army even before WW1 . 3 square meals a day, a bed, authoriy and a wage...sounds better than living in a 2 up 2 down or on a rented peice of land. The Army was a responible option for the irish working class then.

Better even bearing in mind conscription .
your problem seems to be the perceived manner of British rule in ireland , as opposed to the fact of it .
Despite my obvious republican ideals? Aye sure...

what has standard of living got to do with the fact Britian has no right to occupy Irish territory ?
Everything. Do you think that so many people would be opposed to British occupation if Britian was grand towards nationalists? If they treated us equally? If they hadn't used us as cannon fodder in WWI? If they hadn't starved us and gave council houses to a single unionist rather than an entire catholic family?


Michael McVerry and his comrades were in their late teens and early 20s when they held commanding officer positions within the south armagh brigade . British soldiers were happily drinking in the pubs with locals and not terrorising them in the slightest when they took the decison to start killing them .
emm all of a sudden you are opposed to shooting Brits?

[mickyk200]

at this rate of going sinn fein wont have a seat in leinster house in 8 years time , much like the workers party before them . Their party president has proven himself to be an electoral liability rather then an asset south of the border simply due to his ginorance on economic issues and inability to construct an argument during a live debate . And its petit , not petty ..
mite aswell be petty lol...typo gimme a break.

yea well when RSF get a seat in Leinster House then I'll be worried ok ;]

[Hessian Peel]

I consider myself a follower of Connelly

The man's name is Connolly. So you're a Marxist then?

What stops me from supporting the INLA and IRSP is that the INLA continue to carry out irrevalant operations especially down south

What irrelevant operations?

Sínn Féin have the numbers and the popularity so they are the most likely candidates to acieve unity

Fianna Fáil have even bigger numbers and are far more popular.

Surely they are the most likely candidates to achieve unity?

[Foyleview]

God I hate this one republican having a go at another republican stuff, just because they think their republican stance is true r / better / more faithful etc. Can we not concentrate more on what we agree on instead of what we disagree on?

[mickyk200]

The man's name is Connolly. So you're a Marxist then?



What irrelevant operations?



Fianna Fáil have even bigger numbers and are far more popular.

Surely they are the most likely candidates to achieve unity?
Are you having a go at me for a typo? Connelly would be an exceptable version of Connolly as both are common.

Mostly dabbling in the underworld...

Well gis a shout when Fianna Fail start to run in the North

[Carlos McJackle]

[quote=Carlos McJackle;55572][quote=mickyk200;55532]



[QUOTE]No, but a force made up mostly men still filled with the pride of youth can not be perfectly sensible in their actions

like most armies ?


I accept that the provos were by no means rightoues in every area and in every operation. They may have introduced this divide but as far as I know the RIRA have done nothing to reverse these situation.

the republican movement as a whole , the movement to which i belong , issued very clear directives to its membership not to respond to or engage in this civil war mentality nonsense . I maintain cordial relationships with quite a few sinn fein members and supporters . Theres basically only one bar in which the clientele would be predominantly anti gfa . The firm rule is NO POLITICS . Sinn Fein members drink alongside 32 csm members . Politics is a taboo subject . The only people whod be unwelcome are those provisionals whove engaged in mutilation attacks in the district or whove been known to have blackguarded or threatened other republicans on a consistent basis . outside of that theres very little to be done but maintainthe same standards on a consistent basis , and bear in mind its the community as a whole which suffers . That however will not deter those who are intent upon divorcing those who hold a political opinion from their own community by attempting to poison the water to prevent fish from swimming in it .





And the RIRA are picky about who they recruit?

Im not a member so have little knowlege as regards that aspect of their operations . What i do know for sure is that despite numerous mutilation attacks and baoasts not a single member of the PIRA in south armagh has been arrested and questioned in connection with them . Thats not due to any great secrecy . Anyone joining our movement is left in little doubt theyre in for a rough time and will face at the very least repeated attempts to demonise and isolate them within their own community and the blackening of their character . Theres a high possibility of intimidation , abduction , arrest , jail and possibly worse . Therefore the sensible option for anyone seeking to strut about the place like dan breen would be to take the easy option and join the provos .



Your justification is questionable, and I think you'll find the majority of mainsteam republicans would disagree with this "justifcation"


i think youll find most people throughout the world would regard the occupation of any part of their country by a foreign power grounds for armed resistance to that occupation .

I think you'd need to open a book.

save me the trouble and point me to one

3 square meals a day, a bed, authoriy and a wage...sounds better than living in a 2 up 2 down or on a rented peice of land. The Army was a responible option for the irish working class then.

sweet mother of fukk


Despite my obvious republican ideals? Aye sure...

see above


Everything. Do you think that so many people would be opposed to British occupation if Britian was grand towards nationalists? If they treated us equally? If they hadn't used us as cannon fodder in WWI?

our people joined the British army on their own accord and on the advice of their elected political leaders . Irish nationalist leaders theyd overwhelmingly endorsed at the ballot box . Britian was perfectly grand towards nationalists during that period . They had a huge presence and voice within the houses of parliament and were often courted by British political leaders seeking their votes . They werent used as cannon fodder any differently than the manner in which english soldiers , whod been conscripted , were . Upper class english officers had the highest mortality rate of any social or ethnic group during the first world war . Irish prisoners of war were even given the opportunity by the german army to join roger casements IRISH BRIGADE to fight for their own country . Hardly any of them did and casement was received with great hostility despite offering them a chance of freedom.
The motivation behind the 1916 rising had nothing whatsoever to do with english tyranny , which was no worse in Ireland than in england . The motivation behind the 1916 rising was the fact so many Irish people wre content to live under British rule and be part of the empire .
The decision to launch a rising was taken by the IRB in america , not in Ireland . The decision was taken immediately after the visit to Ireland by king george and the enthusiastic welcome he received from millions of Irish people waving little union jacks along every inch of his journey . Thats what led to the rising . And thats why so few supported it and even spat on the rebels as they were led away by British tommies . Many with Irish accents .

If they hadn't starved us and gave council houses to a single unionist rather than an entire catholic family?

this was activity by the stormont governemnt post 1922 , not the westminster governemnt . It was Irishmen who agreed that a protestant parliament for a protestant people should be created in the north . And it was Irishmen who used British artillery and 77 firing squads upon the minority of Irishmen who regarded such a thing as a crime .

[mickyk200]

[quote=mickyk200;55593][quote=Carlos McJackle;55572][quote=mickyk200;55532]





like most armies ?




the republican movement as a whole , the movement to which i belong , issued very clear directives to its membership not to respond to or engage in this civil war mentality nonsense . I maintain cordial relationships with quite a few sinn fein members and supporters . Theres basically only one bar in which the clientele would be predominantly anti gfa . The firm rule is NO POLITICS . Sinn Fein members drink alongside 32 csm members . Politics is a taboo subject . The only people whod be unwelcome are those provisionals whove engaged in mutilation attacks in the district or whove been known to have blackguarded or threatened other republicans on a consistent basis . outside of that theres very little to be done but maintainthe same standards on a consistent basis , and bear in mind its the community as a whole which suffers . That however will not deter those who are intent upon divorcing those who hold a political opinion from their own community by attempting to poison the water to prevent fish from swimming in it .







Im not a member so have little knowlege as regards that aspect of their operations . What i do know for sure is that despite numerous mutilation attacks and baoasts not a single member of the PIRA in south armagh has been arrested and questioned in connection with them . Thats not due to any great secrecy . Anyone joining our movement is left in little doubt theyre in for a rough time and will face at the very least repeated attempts to demonise and isolate them within their own community and the blackening of their character . Theres a high possibility of intimidation , abduction , arrest , jail and possibly worse . Therefore the sensible option for anyone seeking to strut about the place like dan breen would be to take the easy option and join the provos .





i think youll find most people throughout the world would regard the occupation of any part of their country by a foreign power grounds for armed resistance to that occupation .



save me the trouble and point me to one



sweet mother of fukk




see above




our people joined the British army on their own accord and on the advice of their elected political leaders . Irish nationalist leaders theyd overwhelmingly endorsed at the ballot box . Britian was perfectly grand towards nationalists during that period . They had a huge presence and voice within the houses of parliament and were often courted by British political leaders seeking their votes . They werent used as cannon fodder any differently than the manner in which english soldiers , whod been conscripted , were . Upper class english officers had the highest mortality rate of any social or ethnic group during the first world war . Irish prisoners of war were even given the opportunity by the german army to join roger casements IRISH BRIGADE to fight for their own country . Hardly any of them did and casement was received with great hostility despite offering them a chance of freedom.
The motivation behind the 1916 rising had nothing whatsoever to do with english tyranny , which was no worse in Ireland than in england . The motivation behind the 1916 rising was the fact so many Irish people wre content to live under British rule and be part of the empire .
The decision to launch a rising was taken by the IRB in america , not in Ireland . The decision was taken immediately after the visit to Ireland by king george and the enthusiastic welcome he received from millions of Irish people waving little union jacks along every inch of his journey . Thats what led to the rising . And thats why so few supported it and even spat on the rebels as they were led away by British tommies . Many with Irish accents .



this was activity by the stormont governemnt post 1922 , not the westminster governemnt . It was Irishmen who agreed that a protestant parliament for a protestant people should be created in the north . And it was Irishmen who used British artillery and 77 firing squads upon the minority of Irishmen who regarded such a thing as a crime .
this is getting beyond worth it, I think you would agree.
I'll forefit this wee debate if it saves me writing another eassy =]

[Carlos McJackle]

:) a wise decision

[mickyk200]

:) a wise decision
we could agrue all night and just annoy each other and get RSI and make little to no progress.

[Carlos McJackle]

nonsense . ive won hands down and a man blinded by pepper spray on a galloping PSNI horse could see that with an irish news wrapped round his face

[mickyk200]

nonsense . ive won hands down and a man blinded by pepper spray on a galloping PSNI horse could see that with an irish news wrapped round his face
will that f*ck you up?

[rsfarmagh/keady]

The idelogy is republicanism. Armed action is a tactic.

:eusa_clap::eusa_clap::eusa_clap:

[mickyk200]

:eusa_clap::eusa_clap::eusa_clap:
an unorthodox tactic in this day and age ,yes...

[Carlos McJackle]

will that f*ck you up?

nope . im going to keep going untill you admit it . its the principle of the thing .

[mickyk200]

nope . im going to keep going untill you admit it . its the principle of the thing .
I'm not going to admit it just to get on your tits =P

[Carlos McJackle]

youll feel a lot better if you do

[mickyk200]

youll feel a lot better if you do
No I enjoy annoying you...
In the eyes of this forum you havn't offically won this debate unless I admitt it =P

[Hessian Peel]

nonsense . ive won hands down and a man blinded by pepper spray on a galloping PSNI horse could see that with an irish news wrapped round his face

:icon_laugh::icon_laugh::bow:

[mickyk200]

:icon_laugh::icon_laugh::bow:
I've never seen mounted peelers here...

[tireoghan]

Those who would indoctrinate the youth into losing or wasting their lives in pursuit of bankrupt ideology, at the mercy of the likes of Paddy Murray and Gareth O Connor, are not worthy of respect imo.


Is it worthy to respect those who indoctrinated the youth to be at the mercy of O'Callaghan, Scappaticci and Donaldson?

This crap that what the provos wanted and were prepared to do 40 years ago is any different from what the militant republican groups want now is just that - crap! I know - I was in the Provisional movement for long enough.

While I dont see the point in armed struggle - I wouldnt have the audacity to come out with that statement of yours.

This is typical Provisional revisionism

[East Tyrone]

Is it worthy to respect those who indoctrinated the youth to be at the mercy of O'Callaghan, Scappaticci and Donaldson?

This crap that what the provos wanted and were prepared to do 40 years ago is any different from what the militant republican groups want now is just that - crap! I know - I was in the Provisional movement for long enough.

While I dont see the point in armed struggle - I wouldnt have the audacity to come out with that statement of yours.

This is typical Provisional revisionism

The Provos are no longer putting people in harms way; they have learned from the mistakes of the past. Your post only emphasises mine as it is clear that the Brits will do the same again and again and again ad infinitum. Continued militancy will re